The Vessel, a $200 million staircase that keeps getting closed due to suicides
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It's not the fall that kills you, it's the sudden stop once you get to the bottom.
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Ok, this is very good. Yes, thank you for going there. This is prime commenting.
Not being sarcastic. I enjoyed this.
Or a Sui-Slide, towards the bottom is a giant cushy funnel slide that ends with mattress' at the bottom.
Or a bunch of levels of those web of belts that people fall through.
It was so cool that Resident Evil did an homage to the superior movie, Cube- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8Tw4JhzORM
Hear hear! I had a video store guy tell me if I liked Pi then I would also like Cube. He was wrong, but he also wasn't wrong.
it will only shift suicide to somewhere else !
trust me i live not too far from the second most suicidal bridge in north american after the famous golden gate !
It wouldn't reduce suicide at all, it would just make them do it in a more convenient fashion.
It turns out adding barriers to specific methods of suicide is actually quite effective at reducing overall suicide rates.
I know suicide nets have been done before, I can’t recall where though.
Honestly they should just put a net there and start charging bungie tickets
Nope, cant do that! FORCE people to live in our cruel world!
They already spent $200 million on stairs. No more money for healthcare.
Canada has both of those and people still kill themselves every day.
From the amount of people with mental illness now you would need 10% of all people to be therapists.
Universal healthcare includes mental health, Creampuff. And I can tell you from experience that a social safety net can be the thin layer help between depression and suicide. Depression isn't exactly solvable, but it's not terminal, either. Access to counseling and/or medication is key for many, many people. If you prefer data - the US, known the world over for it's broken healthcare system and lackluster social safety net - has some of the highest suicide rates in the wester/euro-centric world. Literally twice as high as the UK - an undisputedly depressing place.
We can do better.
Yikes. What an embarrassing thing to say.
Of course netting is a bandaid solution that will work... that will do nothing to address the underlying issues. Of course not everyone uses one service or another, but that's why we have different ways of approaching problems. What are you even trying to prove?
First off, my alternate theory is vertigo as cause of death.
Second, this is reddit and you'd rather go with trampoline instead of RGB fans? Wtf, do I gotta list the reasons rgb fans > polyester diaphragms. Smh at all y'all
Eh, then you can just jump with a noose around your neck. Like bunjee jumping, just the suicide version.
Or tall glass sides… unless you bring a step ladder there’s no way to do it then. If it was really 200mil that’s be the way to go
Until they hit the rails holding the trampoline part up. Or richochet back into the bottom of the balcony.... Pain.
A 16-storey circular frame, the climbing structure comprises of 2,465 steps, 80 landings and views stretching across the Hudson River and Manhattan - that is the architecture of the place.
https://www.stirworld.com/see-features-heatherwick-s-vessel-ascends-its-way-to-nyc-recognition
They should just pay 10-15 city workers to stand at the bottom ready to catch people
It’s a beautiful place to die, if you’re into industrial modern
Yeah and there’s a beautiful construction elevator right across the street too.
And it even has a red bullseye in the middle to aim for If you are a darts player.
I'll put a glass of water in that red circle and wear a cape next time.
There was a guy maybe like 12ish years back who decided to do himself at Niagara Falls. It was late winter / early spring and there chunks of ice the size of cars flowing over the falls. Guy jumps in above the falls and goes over. People called 911 immediately. Somehow he managed not to drown or get crushed, but it took like 20 minutes or more for a helicopter to spot the guy a good way down river, in near freezing water littered with massive ice chunks. So the helicopter approaches the guy and throw out a heaving line. I believe it was a tour company chopper, not like military search and rescue with swimmers and baskets etc. The guy kept swimming away from them. Eventually the fire department guys got some kind of watercraft out there, and fished him out, alive.
It inspired me to write a song which I did. It was called "He swam away". That's all I remember, or perhaps all I want to. Pretty dark shit, but what fascinated me aside from the incredible fact that the guy lived at all, was 1) you're in such a low place that you decide to end it, in what seems like a horrific but pretty surefire manner, and then you even fail at that, and 2) you somehow survive all that shit, and then refuse help 20 minutes later, but you still keep swimming in freezing, violent water... like wtf!?
Shoulda just swam underwater the whole time as soon as he got down the falls, either he'd pass out and drown or just drown
Or old skool SNES Pilotwings. The jet pack mini-game made me feel so cool.
That's where they should put the trampoline. Tbh, the entire floor should be one.
Hudson yards in NYC. You can take the 7 train from Times Square.
Too many choices in my opinion, I would get to confused and head back to work
I've never understood the point of a suicide net
Surely you can crawl to the edge and jump again?
Suicide prevention researcher here.
Most suicides are impulsive, quick decisions to make an attempt to die. The crisis is time-limited and most people with suicidal thoughts, or even who make attempts, don't die by suicide. If you stop someone once, they usually won't make another attempt. They don't usually switch to another means if their go-to method is taken away. People who want to shoot selves don't Open up their veins if they can't buy a gun. The woman who wants to jump off the bridge isn't going to step out into traffic if she sees the net.
A fear of pain is a huge barrier to people trying to kill themselves. It's why there aren't a lot of completed suicides with knives or self-immolation. A metal net, like they are building under the golden gate bridge is supposed to hurt like hell to land on. And hard to climb out of. If people know they are going to get hurt AND aren't going to die, then they probably won't make an attempt. Landing in a net will also usually give the person a chance to rethink whether they actually want to die. Most attempters do not. There is some other goal.
So that is the theory anyway with anacdotal support. It "feels" like the right answer. There is not a lot of good data to say whether they actually save lives or reduce suicide rates.
That said, for an individual you are concerned about, help them come up with a plan to put time and space between very dangerous items they could use to attempt suicide (firearms, poisons). You can call the national crisis line and ask for advice. 800-273-8255
Info on the golden gate net. http://www.bridgerail.net/golden-gate-bridge-suicides/the-net-fact-sheet
Can confirm.
When I was 19 I tried to kill myself by ODing on, of all things, my antidepressant medication (they were tricyclic, the modern, safe ones weren't working. I guess these weren't working either).
Anyway, it wasn't a cry for help, I told no one I was planning it for fear they'd stop me, I pretended to be totally normal. Almost immediately after swallowing a whole bottle I realised I had blown everything completely out of proportion and I really really did not want to die. I began crying uncontrollably and told my boyfriend what I'd done.
I don't remember much else until I woke up in hospital with IV bruises on my hands, elbows, and feet, and random charcoal stains everywhere. Apparently I was in a coma for a while but luckily I survived. My mother still thinks I wasn't serious and was doing it for attention. Comas are so cool, dontchoono.
I've tried other antidepressants in the 20 odd years since but nothing has worked. Luckily the clarity I gained that day has never left me and I've never tried again. I don't think I ever will, either.
I'm sorry your mum feels that way.
With my mum, I think it was more about avoiding responsibility for any actions that may have contributed to my mental health.
Nothing is ever her fault and since she was a single parent, well there weren't many other people to blame, therefore it wasn't serious and doesn't matter.
I can literally count on one hand the number of times I've heard her apologise. To anyone, not just me.
My sister recently apologised to me for how she has treated me in the past. She said she let mum's bad opinion of me cloud her own judgement but slowly, and especially since mum went into a home a few years ago, she can see me for who I really am. I'm still processing this one. I knew she played us off against each other, I just didn't realise the degree to which she did it, even as adults.
This sounds like my mom too. I had to look at the situation with a whole new perspective so i could find another meaning for her reaction. Yes, its never their fault, but what’s the reason of that, you know?
My episode completed three years last may. It took a lot of therapy to forgive myself, and then look at other’s reactions with a little less victimism (this is not at all me saying that’s your case).
I lost friends that never came back. I’ve tried many ways to reborn that friendship. I learn that it was just too much for them. Doesn’t mean they don’t love me anymore, it only means that the episode hurt them enough to the point of not being able to stick around.
And in our mom’s case, they have to stick around.
You did better than me, it took me another 8 years and getting sober before I dealt with my issues.
My Mum was a very damaged woman from an abusive home, and she spent her life jumping from frying pan to fire to try to escape bad situations.
Her parents could admit no wrong either, so maybe it's a learned behaviour, or possibly the ego protecting self-image. All I know is that when both her and her brother had a discussion with their mum about their childhoods and her total inability to protect them. Her mum made excuse after excuse, and when those were rebuffed, she just sat there and cried, saying nothing. To realise how grievously she failed them you have to know that the one time grandad hit her, even though they were married and it was the 1940s, she left immediately. She was eventually talked into returning and he never hit her again, but she would tell tales on the kids so he would beat them. They lived in fear of the front gate squeaking, signalling their father's return home.
I think my mum did her best. She certainly broke the physical abuse cycle, but how can you grow up and form healthy relationships when you were raised in such a household?
Thanks for sharing.
No medications have ever worked for my anxiety and depression either. I think it's because they try to treat the symptoms not the cause. I know what caused my anxiety, I know my depression is mostly a symptom of my anxiety. The cause is unresolved though, I don't know how to resolve it because I was hurt at a young age by someone I should inherently be able to trust but they won't acknowledge what they did or apologise so I can't move on.
Around the same time my uncle killed himself so I know first hand what it's like when someone you care about kills themselves. I can't do that to the people I care about but I still have suicidal thoughts. Not because I want to die but because I want this to end and nothing else seems to work.
Thanks and, well, you're not wrong.
I have mostly forgiven her for everything, but new information pops up sometimes which takes me a while to process.
But she was a very damaged woman from an abusive home who spent her life jumping from frying pan to fire to try and escape bad situations.
Her parents could admit no wrong either. When both her and her brother had a discussion with their mum about their childhoods and her total inability to protect them, her mum made excuse after excuse and when those were knocked out of the park, she just sat there and cried, saying nothing. To realise how grievously she failed them you have to know that the one time he hit her, even though they were married and it was the 1940s, she left immediately. She was eventually talked into returning and he never hit her again, but she would tell tales on the kids so he would beat them.
I think my mum did her best. She certainly broke the physical abuse cycle, but how can you grow up and form healthy relationships when you were raised in such a household?
Thank you so, so much for being alive. For being you. For sharing your experience. You have no idea how much it helps other people to know it’s possible to find a new perspective on the other side, and it’s not worth doing this to yourself. I’ll remember this post for a while. I used to volunteer at a suicide hotline and friends still ask me “how” or “why” it works. Will show them these answers. Thank you again. Please know you have friends here that would love to get to know you and would be blessed to have you in their lives.
Your a better person than I, and that sounds like a really fucked up situation. I can't answer that question, sadly. It doesn't give her an excuse to pull shit like that though imo. I guess what happens next is up to you.
Wow. Yeah. This hits. I tried ODing on my anti depressants and all the pain medication I could get my hands on when I was about 19. As soon as I did it something flicked and I realised I didn't want to die, but I was so tired I just layed down and didn't have the energy to panic.
I did this about midnight one night. Slept the next 30 something hours and woke up covered in dried puke. Felt like I had been run over by a steam train. No one even noticed me missing. It made me realise I didn't want to die and I had to help myself if I wanted to change.
That was about 10 years ago. I've been off antidepressants since, had a lot of ups and downs but I realise now whenever I have those dark thoughts that I need to change something. Nothing matters more then happiness.
I’ve found that suicidal people don’t want to die, they just want to stop existing
Stop existing is exactly what dying is… what they want is escaping their torments/problems… Source: someone who have dealt with suicide thoughts for ~30 years
It isn’t to everyone, especially religious people, but I understand what you mean. What I meant by my original comment is essentially what you’re saying, I know it all too well as well
Exactly. You don’t want to die or need any attention, it’s just a wish out of existence.
I think the "stop existing" means wishing they wouldn't be born at all. I have had "suicidal thoughts" before, but i was too afraid and scared to just jump off a building or to cut myself. What i wanted was to just not exist. I wished that id just never been born at all.
Edit: ☝That was a totally unintentional bohemian rhapsody reference
Paraphrased, but I read in a book: The people jumping out of an apartment building on fire, aren't not afraid of jumping, falling, or dying from that, they're just more afraid of burning in the fire...Now imagine that burning fire is in your head.
The book also had a (albeit fictional) person say what you said: they don't want to die, and if they could choose a coma over death they would. Just go to sleep for a while and not feel anything.
This is an interesting analogy. To people struggling with suicidal thoughts, often they may feel the problem now is worse than the consequences of whatever they do to try to stop it.
I’m sorry you’ve felt that way. I know how much pain it takes to feel that way.
It’s ok, doing much better than I used to for the most part. Long term antidepressants have been a shit show for me that’s made me worse 95% of the time, highly recommend to any and everyone suicidal to at least consider ketamine infusions if they have the money for it, hope you’re doing better friend
I am in this paradox now i live in a tranquilized existence, no amount of sedated deep no dreaming sleep can prepare me for my alarm clock and the monotony that follows day in day out
I recall reading that a certain state or country started using blister packs for medication and suicide rates went down with the medication because it took time to pop each pill out of the package. Don't remember the medication but it backs up what you're saying about the impulse.
This also brings to mind the importance of not having tons of medication in the house and/or keeping it locked up.
Sure, a person can drive to the drugstore and buy 200 aspirin or whatever if there are only 4 pills in the house, but they probably won't. The time it takes to do that gives them time for the crisis to pass as well as convince themselves not to make a suicide attempt (people are good at finding reasons to live).
Personal notes:
- when I was at my worst, my wife and I went through my huge stash of medicine, threw out all the old ones and locked up all the backstock. She has the combo and gives me only a few days worth at a time. The crisis has passed but we stick with the plan. Makes me feel better knowing that I am a bit safer from impulsive thoughts.
- my father OD'd on his medications. He had been saving them to make an attempt and had been planning his death for over a year. This is less common than an impulsive decision, but shows the danger of large amounts of medication when someone is doing poorly.
The switch from coal gas to natural gas for domestic use in Brirish homes left the suicide rates in the 70s were down by a 1/3 on that in the 60s. The convenient and painless death method had been removed from the house.
Britain converted their ovens from coal gas (which has lots of carbon monoxide) to natural gas in the 70's - and suicide rates permanently dropped by a third. Until then, about half of their suicides were from people breathing oven fumes - turns out removing the suicide machines from peoples' kitchens was a very effective preventative measure.
Yes. It's a great example of the benefits of taking away easy methods of suicide. It won't stop every single person, but it prevented so many deaths.
The time period question is a good one. Short answer: for most, minutes to less than an hour. So very impulsive.
The Houston study interviewed 153 survivors of nearly-lethal suicide attempts, ages 13-34. Survivors of these attempts were thought to be more like suicide completers due to the medical severity of their injuries or the lethality of the methods used. They were asked: “How much time passed between the time you decided to complete suicide and when you actually attempted suicide?” One in four deliberated for less than 5 minutes! (Simon 2005).
Duration of Suicidal Deliberation:
24% said less than 5 minutes
24% said 5-19 minutes
23% said 20 minutes to 1 hour
16% said 2-8 hours
13% said 1 or more days
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/means-matter/duration/
To your second question, I don't know, but I would suspect yet. People often act on other impulsive and fleeting thoughts. Especially true when people are intoxicated. Think about the things you've done when you've been drunk that seemed like a great idea but you would have never done sober. By "you" I mean "me".
Many people who died by suicide had alcohol or drugs in their system.
Shakey. Thanks for the response. I was surprised that it really was almost 3/4 having less than 1 hr between decision to attempt suicide and the attempt. I also thought it was less until I looked it up.
But it does blow the stereotype out of the water.
A lot of the "warning behaviors": giving stuff away, preparing a will, talking about death, changes in mood (better and worse); are giving an indication that the person is spiraling downward and COULD be at risk for suicide. there are less than 50,000 suicides in America each year and there are tens of millions of people struggling with a mental illness or substance use problem. So there are a lot of people who display all of the warning signs but don't complete suicide.
And it is easy to look at the life of a person who completed suicide and identify clear warning signs. But no one has a complete picture in the moment. If you notice warning signs in realtime, what that should clue you into is that the person is certainly at risk of completing suicide at some time.
Even experts can't predict who will complete suicide and when. Rather they talk about people having elevated risks of suicide when compared to other people with similar demographics (usually age and gender).
Example: Bob is a 25 year-old man who just got out of the Marines. Unemployed, drama with his ex-, self-medicating his depression with alcohol, owns guns, refuses to get needed mental healthcare.
All of those pieces of information indicate that Bob is at higher risk than the average 25 year-old male for suicide. None of them by themselves predict that Bob will complete suicide, especially when.
Some people talk about the gun being loaded by preexisting risk factors and then a stressor or crisis pulling the trigger. I think its kind of a morbid analogy, but makes sense to me. There usually is a "last straw" that overwhelms the ability to cope any more.
What can we do to save people's lives if we think they are at risk of suicide and we know they could make an impulsive decision?
Firstly, you need to remember it is not your fault that someone decides to complete suicide. You can do your best, but it's ultimately the decision they made, not what you did or didn't do. (I sometimes still blame myself for my dad's death, but reality is that noone could have stopped him but him)
Throughout this thread people have mentioned some different things that can help reduce the risk of a deadly suicide attempt.
Nets under bridges where there are a lot of suicides. It will reduce deaths certainly, but also reduce the number of people trying as they expect their attempt not to succeed. Blister packs for pills. It takes a lot longer to get together a deadly amount of pills, giving people time to decide to live. Reducing access to firearms and ammo for people at risk. Making a plan for someone else to hold the guns of a person at risk of suicide; locking up all the guns and ammo in the house of a teenager with suicidal thoughts. Providing crisis resources can be helpful too. Those signs on bridges with the crisis line gives the person another chance to see that help is available and then go and get it.
Basically give people tools and time to make a different decision. I suspect the five minutes between deciding to die and trying it feels like an eternity.
And people change their minds and decide to live all the time, even or especially after they make a suicide attempt.
There's a documentary about people jumping from the Golden Gate called "The Bridge" where a researcher filmed The Bridge from a distance with a fixed camera for a year and caught numerous suicides on camera.
He interviews one guy who jumped & lived and the jumper basically says: "As soon as I let go of the bridge, I knew everything that made me want to kill myself was fixable."
Quotes from two Golden Gate Bridge suicide attempt survivors:
"The millisecond my legs cleared it, the millisecond of true free fall, instant regret for my actions," said Kevin.
Ken had a startlingly similar experience: "I just vaulted over, and I realized, at that moment, this is the stupidest thing I could have done. Everything could have changed."
https://abc7news.com/golden-gate-bridge-suicides-suicide-survivors-jump-survive/2010562/
Having attempted suicide myself and been stopped in the process I can confirm that you’re right. Once I was interrupted I didn’t return to my attempt.
Thanks for sharing Datto. I am sorry things were once so bad that you attempted suicide. I am glad you were stopped and that you didn't try again.
Stories like yours can help people to understand that it is worth it to try to stop someone from making a suicide attempt. That this effort will save lives.
Well in this instance it was my dog who stopped me. Some people say I’m too affectionate and cuddly with my dog now but they don’t know the reason why.
I don't think there is such a thing as being too affectionate and cuddly with a dog. Glad you buddy was there for you when you needed him/her
One other thing,
If a person is taking steps to prevent their suicide attempt from being interrupted, the situation is very dangerous.
When my father completed suicide, he waited until all of us were out of town and unplugged his phone so no one was there to stop him. He really felt he had no way out. Very sad that he was hurting that much. And a very terrible thing to do to our family.
That's pretty interesting! speaking from my own experience too, no one really wants to die. People who seek this as a last resort are usually those who see no other escape from their situation or what they're going through, have hit so low that they don't even see how things could ever get better for them, and this is one of the ways to stop suffering.
Please look for medical advise from other specialists, lot of psy conditions which cause depression can be worsened by antidepressants, bipolar disorder for e.g.
Disclaimer: I do not work in medical/psy field but I somehow know it
Thanks for sharing your experience. Sorry you were deep in the darkness and glad you are doing better.
I think you did a great job explaining what I've heard from many people struggling with suicidal thoughts as well as felt myself. "Last resort" sounds about right. If people believed that they personally could pull off any other option to solve their problem/ pain/ sadness/ whatever, they probably wouldn't think suicide was the best solution.
People's decisions and actions make the most sense for them given the information, resources, and frame of mind they are in, even if they wouldn't make sense to that person a few hours later or to another person. People make what they consider bad decisions on purpose.
This is one reason seeking help when one is having suicidal thoughts is so important. If you can't think of any other way to go forward besides dying, you are out of options. Simply talking about your suicidal thoughts with a HELPFUL person can go a long way toward saving your life. Professionals can be great, as can someone who cares about you and can listen without making you feel judged. Other people often have great insights and can help you figure out other options that make sense to you.
Thank you for being brave enough to save a life.
Research on Golden Gate Bridge suicide attempt survivors found 90% did not die later by suicide. Those are good odds.
Of the 515 people whose attempt was interrupted, only 35 later died by suicide in the years to come. Taking into account suicides that might have been missed by researchers, Dr. Seiden stated that 90% of people who tried to jump off the Golden Gate Bridge did not go on to die by suicide.
https://www.speakingofsuicide.com/2013/07/05/suicide-attempt-survivors/
i can attest to this. i was suicidal once long ago. i was extremely exhausted and miserable but the flip side of it was that i had no easily available method of death on hand and i fell asleep before i could come up with something more involved. fortunately when i woke up i had more perspective
Thanks for sharing about your painful moment.
I hope you are doing better now.
These are some really sad stories. I knew New Zealand had high youth suicides, but didn't know why.
It makes me so angry that in the UK you have to hit a threshold for getting help, and the children’s mental health service is especially adamant that you’re not ‘serious’ about committing suicide unless you’ve made a plan or written a note. It’s utter bullshit. I’m trying to get help for my kid, his assessment is tomorrow. I expect they will once again turn him away because he hasn’t got a specific plan and hasn’t written a note, but we know from past experience in the moment he will absolutely try it on an impulse.
The system here is so horribly broken. It’s criminal how they can get away with this.
I am sorry your child is hurting and that you are because you love him/her. And it is complete garbage that it is such a struggle to get the needed help.
Often suicide attempts are impulsive, not planned out, so we can't wait until someone is "serious" enough to write a suicide note to help them.
I hope for the best for your family.
Thank you, I just saw this (I get anxious about notifications), I’m happy to say they seem to be finally taking us seriously and my child was able to get a referral for a full mental health assessment with a psychiatrist. So hopefully it’s the start of the right support. ❤️
just seeing your reply. Wonderful news!! It sounds like a good starting point for getting the help your child needs.
Thank you for sharing this good news, that sometimes things work out!
Grew up in Tampa and remember hearing about it every couple months. They should think about doing something like this.
Yes. It is sad that people will come to landmarks with the plan of killing themselves. Fortunately, there was a barrier erected recently. I hope it can prevent suicides for the reasons explained above. Suicide is fortunately a rare occurrence so it can take some time to have data that allows us to see beyond the normal variation year-to-year.
https://www.tampabay.com/news/transportation/2021/07/23/skyway-bridge-suicides-decline-this-year-with-new-barrier-in-place/
my sister is an ER nurse. a guy came in with severe neck lacerations. he admitted it was a suicide attempt. problem is he lay on a bed with his head tilted back. the doctor explained to him that when you extend your neck backwards the tendons and muscles come to the forefront and it is very hard to cut into the arteries. if you want to cut through the jugular you need to lean your head forward.
the guy did a 90 day stay in the psych ward. soon afterward he showed up in the morgue with his throat cut the proper way.
grim story but... some people are determined to die.
ER doc shoulda known better with his "advice".
This is terrible. And you are right, some people are determined to die, a small number, but absolutely some who want to die.
Up until that fatal action, there is always hope.
It is easy for ER staff, EMS, crisis clinicians, therapists, and loved ones who are exposed to suicidal people to get numb to the seriousness of each crisis.
The doctor's reaction was completely unacceptable and likely contributed to the man's death. That said, the doctor was not responsible for the man's decision.
Please take a person seriously if they are talking about suicide or told you they made an attempt. If they are telling you this, they want help at some level, otherwise they would be dead.
youre right, it is an awful story.
but youre also right that most suicides are momentary bad decisions. the poor man in my story is the anomaly, an exception to the norm.
i read about a survey of people who tried but did not complete suicide where they were overwhelmingly glad they survived and regretted their lapse in judgement.
something to keep in mind if youre ever in a crisis.
tomorrow is another day.
My son changed his method for his second suicide attempt and it was lethal. Some people do switch to a different method. I say this so people won’t be lulled into a false sense of security/relief thinking they have limited the person’s access to lethal means based only on previous attempt choices. It’s recommended that you reduce/limit access to all lethal means.
For more information on suicide prevention (identification of warning signs, what to do, programs and more)
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline www.suicidepreventionlifeline.org
Suicide Prevention Resource Center https://www.sprc.org/
American Association of Suicidology https://suicidology.org/
American Foundation of Suicide Prevention https://afsp.org/
I am sorry. That is very sad. The loss of a family member to suicide is so hard (it was for me, at least).
And you are right. Complacency is dangerous and we can't predict what someone is going to do, but can work with them (often people are willing to work to keep themselves safe when they are not in the crisis) to reduce the risk.
If you need to prevent someone from accessing some dangerous objects (firearms, pills, or poisons being the ones which come to mind first), probably a good idea to do it for all.
Ask the person at risk what means they would consider and what you can do to help them stay safe.
Here is another resource specifically about steps family members can do to keep their loved ones safe
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/means-matter/recommendations/families/
Good question. I don't know the impact of having many bystanders on suicide attempts.
People may not intervene in a suicide attempt, especially if they believe the person will just complete suicide later. We can't count on people being willing to save lives, especially if they have no training and never have done it before.
On the other hand, there are folks who will. Read about Yukio Shige, a retired police officer in Japan who patrolled the "suicide cliffs" and saved hundreds of people.
https://www.latimes.com/world/asia/la-fg-japan-suicide-20180222-story.html
I think the assumption is that landing in a suicide net shocks you into reality. Most barriers to suicide are pretty effective because on an instinctive level your body really doesn't want to kill itself. The goal isn't to make suicide impossible, just to make sure it's never convenient, especially on an impulse.
And if someone's truly dedicated to committing suicide, almost nothing can stop them.
To your last point, very few people are truly dedicated to wanting to kill themselves. And it is really hard to stop them. They have to stop themselves
“A naked person in a padded room can still kill himself, so the fact that you haven’t tells me that you want to keep living. At least a little.”
-My psychiatrist, a long time ago
yes, an "oh shit, i shouldn't have done this" realization comes too late for many.
Here is an interview with a Golden Gate Bridge suicide attempt survivor
“The millisecond my hands left the rail, it was instant regret for my actions," Hines says.
if someone's truly dedicated to committing suicide, almost nothing can stop them.
Supermax cells are designed to insure the occupants have no means of suicide or murder. You will live a long life alone in a simple gray box with nothing to do for 23 hours a day. That's a helluva deterrent or so you'd think
That's a helluva deterrent
I view that as a helluva suicide incentive rather than deterrent.
Exactly, I would not want to live that way. That's when teeth become weapons and you rip out veins.
I've heard it's common for people to have regrets as they fall. Maybe the nets are a second chance for some.?
A lot of people who jump do so and regret it mid air. We only know due the small amount of survivors.
This reminds me of a poem from Bojack Horseman. I always found it very beautiful but profoundly sad:
The View From Halfway Down
The weak breeze whispers nothing
the water screams sublime.
His feet shift, teeter-totter
deep breaths, stand back, it’s time.
Toes untouch the overpass
soon he’s water-bound.
Eyes locked shut but peek to see
the view from halfway down.
A little wind, a summer sun
a river rich and regal.
A flood of fond endorphins
brings a calm that knows no equal.
You’re flying now, you see things
much more clear than from the ground.
It's all okay, or it would be
were you not now halfway down.
Thrash to break from gravity
what now could slow the drop?
All I’d give for toes to touch
the safety back at top.
But this is it, the deed is done
silence drowns the sound.
Before I leaped I should've seen
the view from halfway down.
I really should’ve thought about
the view from halfway down.
I wish I could've known about
the view from halfway down—
I also listened to a podcast from a man who survived a crazy high jump, and he said halfway through he realized he just wanted to be back at the top.
Yup. That has saved me a few times. Not even exaggerating, I had picked the bridge and chosen a date, then I got to that episode and couldn’t go through with it.
Glad you didn’t. Hope you’re doing better these days….its tough I know.
Sounds like a I need to finally give Bojack a shot, I’ve kind of always ignored but have heard its pretty great.
I’m happy you’re here.
Although I’ve never had suicidal thoughts I have thought about what it would be like and why I’ve never seriously contemplated it. Eventhough I’ve had times where I didn’t see the light at the end of the tunnel.
I think I want to feel like I’ll always be in control. That’s why I never want to kill myself. Because the thought of losing control over whether I’ll live or die scares me. Once my feet leave the bridge I won’t have a choice and that scares me.
But death is unescapable. One day I won’t have a choice anymore anyways. I hope when that day comes I’ll be completely okay with it.
I guess suicide at least gives you some control on when to opt out. When you feel like nothing could make things better, suicide gives you a way to leave all your worries behind. So I get the appeal. But when your feet leave to overpass all those worries that clouded your judgment seem so trivial suddenly. You’re suddenly fighting for your live but you have no power. You’ve made your last and worst choice.
Is that lack of control something that scares you?
In a way, but I’ve reached points where I either thought others would be happier if I was dead, or life just felt too hard, its often less about dying, and more about not living.
I went bungee jumping, and upon leaping into the air I was paralyzed with regret and fear. The fact that there was a bungee attached to me wasn't registering - the only thought I was able to have was that I just completely fucked up and now I'm going to die and I wish I hadn't done what I just did.
The second time I jumped was much more enjoyable.
Yes, I watched a video about a guy who survived jumping from the golden gate bridge. Even though he'd been depressed since forever, he said that the split second he left the bridge he knew it was a huge mistake.
Few people realize that it’s really difficult to successfully commit suicide… most of the time you survive with more (health for e.g.) problems that you had before…
Check by yourself… lot of people have failed it even with those methods, finishing with half blown face or para/tetraplegic. Even the « successful » suicide attempts results in lot more pain and agony that the victim (and they are, when you commit suicide, most of the time it’s because the chemical balance of your brain is deficient. We are hard coded to self preservation, not to harm ourself… mental illness, peer pressure, etc… are what trigger suicide, nobody having a happy life wake up one day thinking « fuck this life, I’m over with that ») was expecting.
Not saying it’s impossible, just saying the rates of survival are lower than something like overdose or slitting your wrists
You are probably right, but please if you read this and think about harm yourself, please search help, depression is a hell of a situation which prevent you to take any good decisions, but trust me, there are solutions… please allow others to help you to find it. I know so many people which got help and are so more happy now.
Surely you can crawl to the edge and jump again?
Most people who commit suicide do so very impulsively. If you can stop them even for a moment, that's usually enough. I know the few survivors of jumping off the Golden Gate Bridge have talked about how they instantly regretted it once they were midair. And many people who have been talked out of jumping do not go on to kill themselves later. Which is important because "they'll just kill themselves some other way later" is a common argument people like to use against suicide barriers.
Usually theyre pretty close to the ground so the fall is gonna turn from 40-100 meters to 20meters, which just breaks your bones
People have died from falling just from their standing height to the floor and landing wrong, it never ceases to strike me as the universe being particularly cruel for someone to jump off a building and live.
(To clarify this is not a critique or an attack on you, more of a general observation.)
You know what's funny? This was the first thought I had.
Clicked back and kept on browsing and then I realized how absolutely fucking insane it is that it's our first reaction to this.
Instead of being like, "Why are people doing it, and how can we help them?" it's just, "Put up some fucking nets to catch them, then send them on their way and move on.". I'm sure they probably get some BS interview about it and then booted back to their life after the examination but the effect is the same.
We have such an ass-backwards way of looking at mental health as a species that it's sometimes hard to wrap your brain around or even understand how we got here. We have such a reverence for the brain and all the amazing things it can do, yet when it comes to admitting or fixing the many problems with it we avoid it like the plague.
We're so bizarre.
My bad, I forgot we can't make general statements without being hammered by the literal-ity police.
And by we, in this context, I mean me just so you aren't confused or offended by my statement. Although I suppose "we" could be proper because I'm sure I'm not the only person you've yelled at for this. But I'll limit my observations from now on to only myself so I never accidentally sound like I'm speaking for more than my singular, individual personage.
Well if you aren’t willing to get help for yourself, then who the fuck is suppose to get it for you?
When you are on the verge of killing yourself, your brain isn't functionning logically anymore. Our natural instinct is to get away from anything painful and dangerous, so you must understand that if a person persuades themselves to the point where they are taking actions against their lives then their brain is already heavily affected by chemical imbalances. Then, you can't expect at that moment from them to seek help. They are literally unable of it.
It would be like trying to calm an animal with a leg stuck in a bear trap. No matter how domestic or trained is the animal, when it's hurt and distressed, the chemicals in its brain and body are sending so many MANY different signals, that sometimes even contradict themselves, that it's totally irrelevant to try to calm it. The best you can do is somehow save them, by being calm and educated on the matter, but the more they will panic, the more they are likely to hurt themselves. In critical moments, humans are pretty much similar.
You’re missing the point. Before they get to that precipice they surely have already been having suicidal thoughts. My point was that if they doin’t seek help before they get to that crossroads then how is anybody else suppose to get help for them? Read their minds? It’s not a reasonable request to ask of other people.
Asking for help can be impossible for some people though, especially if your in a depressive feedback loop where your brain has convinced you that nobody in your life gives a shit about you, why would you ask those assholes for help? Add any kind of self medication into the mix like alcohol, and you get thesuicides where people don’t even leave a note for those their leaving behind, it just needs to funking end, ASAP. That’s where I was at the beginning of 2020. I live in a country where the medical system didn’t just throw me under a bus and then drain my life savings for the privilege, and after 3 weeks in a psych ward, I was allowed to go home.
There is so many reasons for why someone in mental distress wouldn't seek help that your point is not standing up. I think you don't mean to be rude or anything. You just have to accept that anyone in this mental situation is already trapped on a dangerous road. I can only speek for myself, but I've read so many other stories about that, I'm pretty sure it's a last-resort brain mechanism. Sure, at first you feel a bit sad, or angry, or anything. And slowly it gets stronger. But, it's not like a disease where someday you wake up and you have blood coming out of your nose. It grows silently inside of you, to the point where it silences you. Some people also don't have the chance to live in safe environments, and trying to talk about their mental health to their social relatives can sometimes put them in more immediate danger than keeping it for themselves. Please understand that every situation is different, and an appropriate help have to be given accordingly to the particular situation.
Nobody said there was a magic answer to mental health issues, otherwise we would already have a vaccin or some type of medication against it. We are at the beginning of understanding how the brain works, so we have no choice but to put a lot of work and effort into trying to avoid such tragedic events. What the person you answered to was trying to say, if I'm not mistaken, is that this is exactly why it should be the top priority, hence the irony. Because installing nets, or stopping people from getting there isn't going to fix their mental issues. It's only going to make them find other ways to do it. It's not like before the net and the access restrictions it was so easy and fun to suicide. Nothing has changed for those that were so distressed they wanted to end it there. Only the place.
There's more attempts to help depressed people nowadays than a century ago, that is true. But it is not a good reference, considering how insignificant it was considered at the time. From most of human history, suicide was either considered as honorific, or a weakness demonstration. And in many countries in the world it hasnt changed. Your words can be very hurtful for those who, deeply, want to seek help, because they value their lifes as any human being, but just can't, because of their situation, or the state of their mental health. You can't expect from a dehydrated person alone in a desert to magically find an oasis with nice people. And sometimes, you don't even know that you entered the desert that it's already too late, and you drink your last water without precaution because, rightfully so, you don't know it is the last time you will have water in your possession.
My comment was lamenting the fact that we (in a general, vague sense) seem to jump to the idea that we should just stop the people doing the thing. While simultaneously not really caring about why they're doing the thing. In this case hurling themselves off things so they can die.
My, and the person I was responding to, first response was to be like "Just hang some nets and done." which upon further reflection felt kinda callous and empty. Why don't we default to the idea of why are people doing it and how can we make it so that they don't feel like they have to? I.E. how do we help these people?
Your comment is pretty much the poster child of thought that in my estimation has kinda led us here. An example -
I worked with a guy who I debated all kinds of topics with while at work, it kept us entertained. On many occasions we'd debate controversial topics and during a news cycle about a girl who convinced her boyfriend to kill himself we ended up talking about suicide and whether or not she should be charged with murder.
To make a long story short one of his reasons as to why she shouldn't be was that he had at one point contemplated suicide and didn't go through with it. Hence if he could do it, that guy should have been able to. Regardless of her influence it was in the end his choice.
I understood the argument he was making, although I vehemently disagreed with it but at its core what struck me was the almost unbelievable level of cruelty in that thought process.
"If I can do it, anyone can and fuck anyone who can't."
Your response bears a similar sort of thought at its core. That everyone, regardless of circumstance or challenge should be able to successfully advocate for themselves.
It belies a painfully deep misunderstanding of what faces some people in their lives, often circumstances well out of their control and sometimes their understanding.
And if they're unable to overcome that... well, I guess fuck them, right?
I understand the reasoning behind why people say it but what I can't quite wrap my head around is why they can't see how utterly ludicrous the statement is.
Barenaked Ladies talk about suicide nets in one of their songs - War On Drugs - it's pretty bleak compared to most of their material, but it's a solid effort, IMHO.
They would have to put nets on every side of the tower and in the middle, not fun
What if they added a diving board?
A Batman comic once explained the emblem on his chest as "something enemies can aim at" but had body armor underneath. Better than risking a shot in the head.
A diving board may attract the attention of the suicide prone, and reduce the need for huge safety nets.
It's not really a good spot.
You really want a spot where you know you aren't gonna land on someone else.
Also, It'd hurt like hell. Read a comment on here about people jumping on 9/11, a lady was talking to a first responder after the fall...
Well there are points for accuracy as well as range and location of splatter.
I believe at best, a few people are tied at 1 point a piece. So far, none has returned to take their second shot.
The higher up you jump from, the more points you get.
Bonus points for doing flips and stuff.
They don't call it brutalist at all. You can tell that it's not Brutalist, because of the way it is.
Is that a reference to something? I have been seeing it on here for nearly a decade and just always assumed it was a Reddit meme
Oh man! Lenny Pepperbottom "Neature Walks". Super dumb video that we used to quote all the time. "You can tell it's an Aspen because of the way that it is. Hehe that's pretty neat!" Def watch it. It's super stupid. Brings back memories.
Cheers man.
God that dudes voice reminds me of Randy Bo-Bandy
Half expect to see him strip down to his tighty whities and fight a bear
but he respects his distance
Rule 1 of brutalism (and also rules 2-10) are that you need exposed concrete. This thing is made of steel and copper.
Yeah like you put this up and expect me not to jump off it? That’s like expecting people not to drive fast on the autobahn.
Also a beautiful place to die
Source: Have bipolar and anxiety. Does weird things to your fear of death.
Healthy people haven’t ever touched dirt and spent more than an hour in the sun.
Paradise is covered in Concrete!
“You don’t know what you got till it’s gone. They paved paradise and put up a parking lot “.
It’s a beautiful place to die, if you’re into industrial modern
Great to do stair training. The poor stairs at the hs stadium get so boring....
I'm not going to lie it looks amazing but it also looks like a waste of money but I'm not an engineer. Just seems like it could be more efficient at a glance
IIRC It's now closed indefinitely. Now recorded four suicides in 2 years. 😥 After the third suicide they added a 'buddy system', no lone people on the staircase. The latest, and hopefully last suicide from this staircase, was a teenage boy, there with his family and he jumped while they were standing next to him. It's now closed to sightseers and may be dismantled.
https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/07/us/vessel-hudson-yards-suicide-wellness/index.html
"The kid was racing up the stairs with his younger sister and having a blast, having so much fun,’’ said a security guard at the Manhattan tourist attraction to The Post on Friday, a day after fatal jump.
“One of my colleagues told them, ‘I know it’s fun and stuff, but you are not allowed to run in the Vessel,’ and, ‘Stay with your parents.’ Somehow, when he got to Level Eight, he jumped,” the guard said of the teen from upscale Livingston, New Jersey."
I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but that 8th floor.... gives me the heeby geebies
I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but that 8th floor.... gives me the heeby geebies
Wait what am I missing here? What's with the eighth floor?
Wait what am I missing here? What's with the eighth floor?
You ever have the urge to just chuck your phone off a bridge?
Idk why but I always get the same feeling when I am 7th floor and up
That’s why I can’t do high places like that man. My brain just says “what if my body was suddenly tossed off this high place” and I curl up in a little ball just thinking about it lol
I forget the word for it (I believe it's french) but it's described as 'call of the void'.
They're called intrusive thoughts, and they're a symptom of OCD.
Mayo clinic link here, see under "obsessions"
Before anyone uses this to diagnose themselves, consider that the D in OCD stands for "disorder" i.e. something which interferes with your life.
I get intrusive thoughts. When I'm close to a ledge, I some times think about jumping. I don't want to jump, and I respond by being more careful around ledges. When I'm doing the dishes, I some times imagine dropping a knife on the cat. I don't want to kill my cat, and I respond by being careful with how I handle sharp things. When I am driving, I some times feel like jumping a curb and mowing down pedestrians. I don't want to run anyone over, and I respond by slowing down and becoming better aware of my surroundings.
It's not a disorder because it doesn't have a negative impact. It even has benefits (I hurt myself less and my driving is better). It's more of a quirk.
I had no idea this was a thing. I thought I was insane. I've always been reluctant to go on building roofs because of a fear that I would mindlessly jump off. I'm not suicidal, so it chills me to think about. Thank you for commenting.
That's why I'd be too terrified to live in the US. I feel the exact same way, but not only about high buildings, but also about guns. That "mindlessly jump off" describes that so well. I never thought others have similar thoughts / impulses. Thank you!
As with many psychological phenomenon knowing about it can help you avoid it. Another important one to be aware of is bystander effect. Basically the more people see a problem the less likely each individual is to help, and then nobody will help. It requires somebody to break the social tension to get everybody else to jump in to help
At least for me, I felt the call of the void feeling very strongly at the top. My hand barely left s railing, but then again I'm chickenshit when it comes to heights.
Call of the void is how your brains protect you from jumping tho. It’s to process how the situation would end.
In numerology, 8 is associated with bad luck and misery. It’s not something I’ve really people mention much living in Europe, but from the time I’ve spent in Asia it and the number 4 are often regarded as superstitious numbers and avoided.
Although this place is in New York, and I really don’t know how popular numerology is in America to be sure if this is what the other person was alluding to.
In China the number 8 is regarding as good luck and everyone wants anything with numerals to contain 8. It's because 8 sounds like "prosper/wealth." People pay extra money for have more 8s in their telephone numbers. It's definitely not avoided, it's the exact opposite.
4 though is avoided since it's a homophone with the Mandarin word for death.
Yes, while I’ve never been to China I do speak broken Mandarin and I’ve been told Bā is lucky because it sounds similar to the word for wealthy, and I believe it’s also a lucky number in Japan.
What I meant, which might not have been clear now I’m re-reading it, is that from my time in Southeast Asia numerology is at least slightly popular amongst the people I met there, compared nobody in Europe.
It's just the highest and one would prefer that for a suicide. But it's also strange that the boy was having a blast and suddenly decided to jump to his death.
I've been to the 8th floor before. You can google a picture of the Vessel online, but it's high up with railings that aren't that high. Not high enough to accidentally fall off, but maybe drop your phone.
“8 is just a scrunched up together 13”
A misquoted Mitch Hedburg joke
I had a doctor once tell me that many times when people blame suicides on antidepressants, what has happened is the person had been intending to attempt suicide but their illness had completely zapped them of the energy and ability to carry out the task. Once they started feeling just a little bit better they are able to act on their desires
Its a big fear people have when going into recovery, “what if i feel good enough to do it this time?” Its a scary thought. Its why good therapy, medication and mindfulness/coping skills are all so important together.
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Nope. Kid had a history of suicide attempts. Just regular ol mental health crisis stuff that he learned to mask well enough to be allowed to visit the place. Really tragic stuff.
jesus yes. Everyone has intrusive thoughts, yet they don't throw themselves from a monumental staircase with their little sister right behind them.
People need to stop looking right past common mental health issues that can be very easily hidden and blaming "momentary bout of madness" or whatever name they're calling the fact that they don't fathom/refuse to consider a normal person could possibly do something so gruesome.
Yeah if someone just randomly chooses to kill themselves they had to have had that thought simmering in the background for a while whether noticed by the outside world or not.
Months or weeks at a time usually. Its really hard to deal with when you get good at masking it.
Really, the solution is more mental health support rather than just closing this one staircase then. It's really sad to hear that story
Check out the work on the concept of “suicide magnets”, though. Studies have shown that suicidal ideation focuses on a specific plan of action that includes a method and location, and that breaking even trivial elements of that plan can buy the person a moment of reflection that their otherwise pathological impulsivity might never give them. When suicide barriers are erected in places that are known to attract frequent jumpers, for example, nearby high places do not experience an increase in use as alternate method site, as was initially feared. Sometimes the only choice is to close or radically redesign, until the fixations for that place, often based on knowledge of past “successes”, wear off.
I think about how quick and clean the cut to my own jugular would be with my kitchen knives, every time I hold them. Those blades are wonderfully made, and I take good care of them with cleaning and sharpening. There's just an allure to being so close to death, and taking your own life so quickly, with as clean a cut as it would be, by your own well-maintained tool.
Y’all really reach for anything lol. Bonus points for using a Reddit fav “call of the void”
Can I confess something? I tell you this as an artist, I think you'll understand. Sometimes when I'm driving... on the road at night... I see two headlights coming toward me. Fast. I have this sudden impulse to turn the wheel quickly, head-on into the oncoming car. I can anticipate the explosion. The sound of shattering glass. The... flames rising out of the flowing gasoline.
They only become a problem when you dwell on them.
I try and make a joke out of them.
It's quote from Annie Hall. The character who says it is a young Christopher Walken! if you can't tell from the elliptical speaking pattern
ah. thanks for clarifying. I haven't seen that movie in years
Right. Well, I have to – I have to go now, Duane, because I, I’m due back on the planet Earth.
I've had a nightmare before of a similar situation, a car riding on the angled wall of an embankment crashing down onto the car that I was in, I could feel the crush of the impact on my back as I ducked down, then an insane burn, then all of the sudden, nothing. Just an empty void in my mind. That nightmare has never left my mind ever since I had it a few years ago.
I ain't an artist, and I get this junk stuck in my head all the time. Call it the "Call of the Void" and make a poetic song and dance about it, but to me, it's like the crap stuck in my aquarium's filters; of no use, fleeting, causes harm, and needs to be thrown in the trash.
The other vehicle may have children or new born babies, or just an innocent human nonetheless.
Fuuuuck. I have a hard time on high rise balconies because of this. “I wonder what it’s like to jump….?”
Idk, man, 8 floors high seems definitely high, especially as a kid. I've never looked off the roof of my garagr and thought "Let's send it", I'd break an ankle or something.
That kid was thrown off the eigth floor, probably some psycho.
If what the security guard is true, then it doesn't sound like suicide. How do they know that's what it was? Could the parents claim that it was suicide so they don't look like bad parents, letting their kid run around unsupervised, like has has happened at many zoos? Could be true but also could of been an accident.
I don’t know. When I was that age I thought I could do almost anything and not get hurt. I could see him showing off to his sibling. I grew up in the generation that didn’t wear helmets so I may be out of touch with kid’s psyche these days, but the circumstances seem odd. Tragic either way.
I feel like you may be alone in that regard? I would know better from a younger age lol, you don’t jump off high places is pretty common knowledge. You learn that from jumping off a tree at like 6 years old and twisting your ankle Edit: bruh I thought it was like a 10 year old, 14? That was definitely a suicide
Same I actually live a town over from where the kid was from and everyone around here heard about it, was pretty chilling after visiting it myself
Don't know how the thing looks but maybe it wasn't suicides and people thinking they could drop from one floor of the staircase to the next. I'd think a kid would believe they are able to make that.
People that have decided on committed suicide are said to be acting happy and stressfree though, so it for sure sounds like suicide. It's also a tourist attraction, so if the parents lifted him over the railing I'm sure someone would have seen that
It was suicide there was no accident. I was literally standing 3-4 feet from the kid when he went over that day. Guard was talking to us about the structure the kid had his hands on the rail facing away from the center just looking out. Within a second he was up and over. Never even looked back as his father yelled for him.
I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but that 8th floor.... gives me the heeby geebies
Why? What's the conspiracy?
Reminds me of a bridge in the city I live in that goes over the rails and there's usually a few suicides a year on it. They're now doing stuff there, not sure if to reduce the suicides or just structural repairs but I do wonder if places where someone can kill themselves are at fault and to be avoided just because some people wanna die. Like they'd probably find some other place to do it anyways
There’s a bridge in Ithaca, NY just near Cornell University that basically has half an aviary cage of fencing because of the Ivy League students getting poor grades and jumping
I mean I’ve seen the one in Ithaca before, it didn’t always look the way it does today and there was only one reason.
Upstate New York will have that effect on you, what a frozen wasteland.
A kid in my dorm was found at the bottom of the gorge my freshman year. I haven’t looked at the statistics recently, but around that time there actually were fewer suicides at Cornell than at other ivies but they got more attention because jumping into a gorge is more attention grabbing than OD’ing on pills.
There's a bridge in Auckland, NZ where I come from called Grafton Bridge. Sadly it was a suicide spot for many years. It now has high glass barriers that slope inwards over the footpath to prevent people taking their own lives. You're right, people can't use this site but it doesn't solve the underlying societal problems that lead to many suicides.
Closing a staircase over 4 suicides in 2 years is pretty extreme. Based on that logic we ought to shut down the Golden Gate Bridge or the Brooklyn Bridge as well.
I don't know if that's a fair comparison since the bridges serve an actual function whereas The Vessel is more or less an art installation.
I think the main difference is one makes a splash, the other makes a mess.
also one is a means of getting somewhere for hundreds of thousands of people, while the other is a glorified art project for the rich
It’s free admission at certain times of the day though? And it’s not like the Golden Gate Bridge needs pedestrian access.
Then someone will just drive onto the bridge and get out of their car. All of this shit is just bandaid fixed that don't address the actual problem
Adding barriers to common methods of suicide is actually quite effective at reducing overall suicide rates.
That's not to say that we don't need to address the underlying issues that lead to the level of depression where suicide seems like the best way out. But these bandaid fixes do a pretty good job of preventing people from actually ending their lives.
Let me introduce you to, The Pressure washer, capable of cleaning any surface with it's high pressure water jet. It evaporates any trace of unwanted materials, this includes: moss, grass, humans, rocks, algae and more! It even works underwater!
(Not actually tested underwater, tested on my thumb, can confirm it hurts, but it was really clean afterwards. Probably effective against "splash")
A human needs to operate the pressure washer so you’re still needlessly exposing someone to the trauma of cleaning up a body
Hudson Yards is primarily a shopping center for rich people. No one wants to drop thousands at Cartier and then step over a dead body that looks like a smashed watermelon on their way out.
The owner is the one who decided to close it down. He doesnt want to give people that and likely doesnt want to have legal problems as a result down the road.
Those are important pieces of infrastructure in their respective cities and the Vessel is not.
I was about to comment this. They ought to dismantle the Eiffel tower too!
I feel so bad for the family. “Let’s take our son out and spend time with him, show him some love.” And instead he ends it with you standing there. I mean there had to be red flags that he wasn’t ok. Why take him to a place that is increasingly becoming known for suicides? Mind boggling
I don't know about this boy, but there aren't always red flags. Many people suffer without ever showing anyone.
I suffered most of my life, and I got really good at hiding how I really felt, wearing a smile anytime I was out in public. I had plenty of friends, people liked me, but I was always so empty inside. I hated myself so much. One day, I was driving my car and I had this idea to just turn the wheel, hit another car, and end it all right there. I took off my seat belt, increased speed a little bit, and immediately felt guilt in the fact that I could actually hurt someone else. What if there was a family in there? Children. Animals. Innocent people that didn't deserve to suffer from my bullshit. So I instead pulled over, sat there for awhile, probably about an hour, just thinking about so many things, and then I went home, and told my wife that I really needed her help. We sat down and talked, and for the first time in my life, I opened up about my depression, and what it was doing to me. I told her about what happened to me as a child, I told her everything, and it was hard for me, but I did my best to just let it all out. She had no idea I grew up with depression, and I felt like shit for not telling her, but I honestly felt worthless, like talking to her about it was just a massive waste of her time, and it honestly felt really good hearing her support for me.
I agree with you, while the signs are there, it's not always visible to others, and quite often that's intentional. I still have bouts of depression, and I have a feeling it will be with me for life. I was told I'm manic depressive, which is something that is around forever, but I manage to survive.
Before anyone asks, I've tried meds before, 4 different kinds. 2 of them did next to nothing for me outside make me drowsy or somewhat sick, one of them constantly made me super sick, and one of them made me worse, intensifying the feeling of me wanting to kill myself until I almost bathed with a toaster one day. It was so bad, I had right down to the letter how I was going to kill myself, including how I could have been found, and how I could do it so cleanup was as easy as possible, because while I was likely to be a burden to someone one last time, I didn't want to be too much of one. The only thing that keeps me from "going" now is my video games, my wife, my daughter, and trying to keep as positive an outlook as I can, which isn't always easy, but that's where my wife comes along and keeps me grounded. I firmly believe I wouldn't be here if it weren't for her and her support. Truly.
If I have any advice for people, don't assume that the signs will be blatant and visible. Sometimes it's a gentle, near invisible cry for help from someone who is positive they are too much of a burden on you to waste your time talking to them about it. Pay close attention to those around you. Be a willing ear, sit and listen, and just be there for the people close to you, (when you are in a good state of mind of course, and you aren't overburdened with your own problems) It could very well save a life.
Thank you. For the first time in a very long time, I can say with pride that it feels good to be here. I can't say every day is a cakewalk, I still have very troubled days and nights, but I now feel that I may actually be able survive this. To me, that's huge. It's a hope I didn't have for years, and I have all the people who stood by me and listened when I needed an ear to thank for that. You as well, for not criticizing me like some others just did both in a comment here, and in personal messages. It honestly means a lot to me.
I'd like to echo the other poster's sentiment too, it's good to read your messages and the evident will and determination you have to be here with us. Sorry you've had critical messages - there is always a silent majority of more supportive people out there, it's just sometimes more difficult to articulate.
Thank you. I understand that there will always be positive and negative surrounding this topic. A lot of people understand this, and many don't, which is part of why there is such a huge stigma surrounding it. I think that's just how people are, and it's not likely to change any time soon. Honestly, knowing there is support for people like me is enough to tell me that there is hope, and there is a place for me in this world. Thank you for taking the time to listen to my story. It really means a lot to me.
I remember when I went through depression (not got to the point of contemplating suicide but it was still the worst time of my life) I would silently hope that specific people in my life would just ask me if everything is alright. I never got the courage to go up to them to talk about it. But I just hoped that they would. For better or for worse most of them never did.
And when my mom (which is one of them) did ask me if I'm alright I put on a brave face and said something along the lines of "Sure. No problem."
Eventually I did speak to her and it really did help. I can't describe it fully but there is an intense desire to talk to other people yet I was still too ashamed to do it.
It truly is a terrible place to be in and I don't wish it on anyone. I'm glad you decided to talk to your wife and I truly hope that God will bless you with peace.
Much love,
Mr Ogre
Thank you for sharing that with me. I appreciate that you were comfortable enough to open up to me about a time in your life that had to be among the hardest. I am really glad you managed to pull through it, to talk about it with someone, and that you're doing better now. I wish you the best in the future, and hope it's filled with happiness and love.
I am really glad you posted this. I am in a shitty spot rn and going through a lot of thoughts about self harm. I identify a lot with what you posted, I have a lot of self loathing issues and have learned how to wear a mask while I feel absolutely miserable inside. constantly. for decades.
I still feel like shit, but I appreciate reading about your experience. Its given me some compassion I would never give myself.
I understand what you're going through. I know that it is hard to open up to others around you, I know it can feel like you're not worth it, but you are. If you can't find the strength in yourself to feel compassion towards yourself, then I will feel it for you. I will tell you the same thing my wife tells me. You are not alone, you are not worthless, you matter. I had to learn over a very long time that these aren't just words, they are a sign that people care, and even if it were just one person that I mattered to, that would be enough. I may not be the world, but to one person, I may be their world, and to me, that's bigger than I could ever imagine. I quit smoking and drinking, and the pride my daughter had for me in those moments was enough to breathe life back into me a thousand times over.
I don't know you personally, but you took the time to share with me your feelings, and your struggles, and I thank you for that. Sincerely. Admitting we have a problem is the first step towards any kind of recovery, and any kind of real happiness.
I know people say this a lot, but if you ever need someone to talk to, or someone to just message so you can get your thoughts down, message me. I will listen. I may not always be in the best position to give any advice, but I find often just listening and being supportive can be enough. If not me, then I urge you to find someone you can open up to, someone you trust, it doesn't matter if it's a spouse, a friend, a relative, or a co-worker. Having someone to support you is more helpful than you know. It may just be one person, but it honestly saved my life.
I wish you the best in your future, and I hope that one day you find true happiness, so that you can know peace in your heart and mind.
youre a really good person. thank you for typing that out. I genuinely appreciate it.
Look into getting GeneSight testing - they can give recommendations as to which medicines you will best tolerate.
This is a very well written and excellent explanation. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you for taking the time to read it all. It's never easy to put this sort of things into words, so I sincerely appreciate your kind words.
Life can be hard sometimes, I get it! I hope you continue on a path to a healthy emotional outlook.
i have the impression that there is too much focus on anti depressants/SSRI alone, and more or less none on SSRI plus phase prophylactica.
i first had to live half my life in depression, losing everything that is dear to me, before a new psychiatrist prescribing me lamotrigin to stabilize the my depression-typical ups and downs that destroyed my will to live.
dude single handedly saved my life.
Also parents (in my experience) aren’t always as caring as everyone likes to think.
No but you don’t understand, Americans are correct, never mind that Ireland has existed for longer and helped colonise America.
Also one extreme red flag is if they're suddenly in a better mood (because they've made up their mind). I have to think almost nobody would recognize that as a danger without being warned beforehand
A lot of people who kill themselves act happy and peaceful in the days before their suicide. People who were close to them are always surprised because the victim appears happy and full of life, only because they’re ready to end their suffering the next day. That’s probably why he was racing up the stairs with his younger sister, appearing mentally well, only to jump. Red flags are often difficult to spot unless you understand this drastic change in behavior, and even then it’s difficult to spot. It makes me sad to even think about this stuff
This isn’t how suicide attempts pan out for a lot of people. As a survivor myself I hid my struggle from family very well and when it happened they were in total shock. Definitely not surprised the family took him there it’s a popular attraction and an impressive architectural feat. The same thing happened with the Empire State Building and that’s why it has a prevention fence now.
Also this landmark isn’t universally known as a suicide magnet yet though this most recent incident kind of cements it as one. In fact most actual New Yorkers just became aware of this after the previous third one which received more attention on social media.
Sadly the kid had attempted suicide before and had a long history of mental illness. It's easy to look back and say "ok so don't take them to the tall stairs" but in the moment you'd just be happy that your kid seems to finally be happy.
He had a history of suicide attempts but learned to mask it well enough to be allowed to go.
I wanted to say something mean but considering we are talking about depression and suicide I’m not going to do that. Please be more respectful to people you don’t agree with. You don’t know my experience or experiences of people I know, as I don’t know you. I hope you find peace and happiness.
I was there back in June. I saw a suicide awareness sign at the bottom steps that had links to resources. I thought to myself, what a weird place to put that sign, and didn’t think much about it.
Later, when I was up top and walking around, one of the security guards stopped me and told me I needed to find my group that I came up with because I wasn’t allowed to be alone. I had no idea people were committing suicide like this.
People committing suicides there did ruin something nice for everybody.
Nobody exists in a vacuum, and we are largely a product of the environment and time in which we were born and grew up. We still need to draw a line somewhere for when we start assigning responsibility.
We have a term for the "circle of violence", but that doesn't mean we never assign the responsibility of not hurting or killing to the people trapped in one, because then it gets hard to assign responsibility for anything.
People really suck. They ruin everything. That place looks like an amazing sightseeing platform and now it's closed because a few people ruined it for everyone else
It's only 2 years old do it probably does still look that good. We were in NYC in 2018 and it wasn't finished. Was looking at photos of it about a week ago. Glass barriers of an unscaleable height would help.
I was there in May and it was definitely open. The article seems pretty new so maybe it’s recently closed. Sucks cause it’s a very cool structure.
Wikipedia says it reopened in may, then someone committed suicide in late July, then it was closed indefinitely.
The last time I was around there they were making people use the buddy system if they wanted to go onto it
I was there last week and it was open. It being closed indefinitely is a rumor I've been hearing for 6 months but I've been there regularly and it's always open.
That's stupid they're going to dismantle it just because a few people have killed themselves from it.
This is why we can't have nice things?
What a stupid reason to have to close something so cool.
That's silly, if people want to jump off, let 'em. Maybe make a spot in the middle that's sectioned off so people who wish to commit suicide can just jump there and not worry about taking someone else out with them.
Hey the Bloor viaduct is featured on that article! I've killed myself on that bridge dozens of times.
Is the buddy system why the one guy is being drug there at the top left ?
Why would they dismantle it? Just don’t let people on it or build taller fences on the sides.
That sucks. It’s actually really cool to go up. Glad I got to a couple years ago.
I'm guessing since it's a crowded area and their bodies land on the floor where everyone can see, it's a bigger deal than people committing suicide on something like the Golden Gate bridge where it's not as visible.
Aw crap & I didn't even get to go. No more nice views out of the GWB because of the netting.
I think that's a bit dumb and pure correlation because those poor people would have probably suicided anywhere else.
After the third suicide they added a 'buddy system', no lone people on the staircase.
Wait what if you have no friends? Do you just have to wait for a random stranger?
Why close it though, if people are so suicidal they’re gonna suicide regardless of the conveniently cool looking staircase or not, I doubt closing it lowers the suicide rates or something
Look up "Sarco Device".
They're here. It's just a matter of legality and distribution.
We should get people to kill themselves less not make it easier. If it was easy I’d be dead on impulse when I don’t want to be so fuck off.
I care about people having access to painless death.
If you want help preventing your own suicide, there are hotlines for you. If you need someone to listen, people are there for you. If you need help with mental health issues, there are resources available to you. If cost is an issue, there are free online resources.
But you shouldn't get to stand in the way of everyone else.
Fuck you then for wanting to make the world even more painful and unsafe for people with mental health issues. I’m autistic and get easily overwhelmed it doesn’t mean I’m worthless. 🖕🖕🖕
Maybe do some research on how autistic brains work instead of being callous and wanting us all dead.
Well, I’ve always been in support of doctor assisted suicide. I think if that’s really the wish of a person, they should be evaluated first to make sure they’re of sound kind to make such a decision. It’s important that other people are involved in the process and can stop it if necessary.
Hm, I didn’t consider that. I’m sorry to hear that, and I don’t think there’s much I can offer in response.
Life has a lot to it. My sister was unbelievably depressed until dance and political action gave her purpose. Maybe there’s smth out there that could change things for you.
I agree. If I knew I could die painlessly whenever I wanted, I’d make so much more of my life.
That last paragraph sounds like the actions taken by a sound mind, do suicidal people have that?
Its even worse than that. This was closed down because there were 4 suicides in 2 months. The billionaire who built it didn't want to change the aesthetics (for better barriers) so added more security guards and put in a rule in place that you had to be with somebody else to enter. Two weeks ago a 14 year old who was with his family jumped to his death.
Fuck sake. Reminds me of a teen in my area who jumped infront of a train whilst with her mom and sister. Just awful
No, we firstly need the world to become not as shitty as it is. There are a lot of reason for depression and suicidal tendencies around. Can't fix that with a pill and a talk.
Or just let people commit suicide when they realize how shitty capitalism and their is nothing to do abott it climate change
oh right, it's totally that and not the fact that capitalism encourage profit any cost, which cause things like employer pay their workers so little that it's a huge factor in depression, and if they want something better than starving wage, they might be forced into stressful jobs that does not fit them, causing depressions and suicides.
so why don't we try to limit corporate greed? you don't need to re-invent the wheel when the solution is right in front of you. capitalism is fine, we need better regulations for the ultra-rich and better community resources. I've never heard of a better system than social capitalism and you can look at places like Norway which is one of the happiest in the world and see it working successfully
4 suicides in 2 years, not months. For context, the Golden Gate Bridge would have averaged 60 suicides in that time.
The billionaire who built it didn't want to change the aesthetics
I must have turned into a callous asshole, because I agree with him. Why should he have to? It's a major destination for architects because nothing else like it exists in the world.
It's fucked up that people are using this as a method of suicide because it's full of people all of the time. It's fucked up to choose to traumatize that many people using such a method.
Designs get adapted and changed all the time. Imagine building an online service and not wanting to change the design to improve the user experience.
Like, the main purpose of design in the first place is not the aesthetics, but form that supports function. If it doesn’t function well, change and adapt. Because watching people die is a terrible user experience.
I’m sure architects can come up with an aesthetically pleasing solution that prevents suicides. Otherwise, they’re not very good architects in the first place.
You don't understand the Vessel then, and that's fine. I went to it immediately after it opened. Literally the only purpose of that thing is aesthetics - it was always a vanity project. I'm not even really a fan - the money spent on it could have been spent on useful projects instead, but here we are. The experience of it is extremely unique - any suicide prevention add-ons are going to clash with the aesthetics, snide remarks about skill aside.
I had a schoolmate suicide on the last day of school at 14. He was a sufferer of all kinds of abuse and it was easier for him to die than to tell his dad he failed the class.
There are many other reasons kids make those decisions. Bullying, mental health issues, gender dysphoria, …
Very sad indeed.
Have you heard of the Golden Gate Bridge? I've personally witnessed it twice. Once from the bike path on the other side of the roadway (I saw him splash when I looked over my edge. He did not float again.) The other time standing on the shore looking at pelicans. This time the coast guard boat came out after about 15 minutes and started looking for him.
It takes about 3 seconds I'd say.
Hmm, so closer to 4....a bit short... When I used to sky dive I always had this brief moment during free fall, right as I reached to deploy, every single time, this thought ran through my head "hmm falling feels really nice.... I wouldn't even feel the impact"
I believe it is a little longer, most SF Bridge jumpers survive the fall only to break many many bones, limbs not working, they drown in agony
This thing is not as high as the bridge but concrete is harder than water.
Watch it if you want to feel deeply sad for a day, and a little sad for the week after.
Was cycling across there once and two body-builder sized uniformed military guys pull up in a golf-buggy with shoulders and assault rifles barely able to squeeze in, to stop someone about to jump, seemed a bit excessive. But a woman talked them down just as they arrived. Didn't even notice we were right next to them.
Threatening to shoot someone is actually very effective at stopping suicides. They don't want to be killed they want to do it their selves. Yes it makes no sense but so does suicide.
Was the next June/July after 9/11. All the airports were still heavily guarded then too. 6 weeks total, spent 4 weeks driving from coast to coast, was good fun.
Imagine people not having access to healthcare and throwing 200 mil on a dumb staircase.
That's the great thing about buildings in general. Even if is a 'massive waste of someone's money', most of that money is going to materials, fabrication, engineers, architects, contractors, installers, etc. It's not a historically significant painting or a bitcoin; that money is actually going to places that support people and are relevant today.
Could it have been spent on something that actually has some feasible use or function? Sure! But the money isn't going into a void.
It was paid for by Hudson Yards developer Related Companies, a private company. So no, it was not stolen from low income neighborhoods.
Related was able to gerrymander a series of Targeted Employment Areas (TEA) so that the site would qualify as a "rural" or "distressed urban area" and, in turn, be able to benefit from EB-5 visa applicant investment funds. The EB-5 program is meant to spur investment in underdeveloped areas suffering from high unemployment through immigrants basically "buying" visas in the form of capital investment in those areas. I don't think anyone would characterize Hudson Yards as "rural", "distressed", or suffering from extraordinary unemployment. So even if it was legal, it seems to have violated the spirit of the program.
It should not have been legal. The governing authority should never have allowed it.
I agree, but unfortunately, New York's Empire State Development Agency allowed this to happen and approved Related's application. (Who knows if they were even complicit in coming up with this scheme, which involved tying underdeveloped Harlem census tracts to Hudson Yards luxury developments).
I know we harp on Trump a lot on Reddit, but this was one of the blatant money grabs from his administration and everyone knew it at the time. They intentionally changed the program administration to make shit like this possible.
Its both, it's a federal immigration program but States used to decide what the investment areas were (I think they still decide some of them, not sure). And to be fair, this area couldn't have been developed under Trump, the program's always been famously crooked. So that was hyperbolic in the first post.
But Trump changed a bunch of the rules (claiming they were reforming it), including giving DHS compete discretion in designating (at least some of) the investment areas. And, surprise surprise, now that a Trump appointee was in charge of it, a bunch of the new areas included big developments by Trump's allies including.... Jared Kushner. Kushner's biggest development is in an investment zone and there's no sane argument to call it "economically distressed", which is supposed to be how the areas are assigned.
So yeah, while Trump railed against people gaming the immigration system, he changed the rules to allow his son-in-law to game the immigration system for millions.
Hudson Yards was distressed as it covers literal open air train tracks.
Aka land that wouldn't be available for use without substantial investment to "deck" over the train tracks.
Reclaiming space for the city and adding to the tax rolls.
For the purposes of this visa program, "distressed" is defined in terms of an MSA's per capita income and unemployment as opposed to land use or best and highest use of a particular parcel - so from that perspective, the site shouldn't have qualified on its own.
The West Side Yard is a crucial piece of MTA infrastructure that allows the LIRR to bring millions of riders in and out of NYC - hardly a distressed use of land. 20 years ago, no one would dare build office buildings west of 8th Ave (witness Ogilvy & Mather's controversial move), and the West Side was a broad swath of "underdeveloped" land - because there was no demand for it. Only in recent years did we get to a point where it did make crazy financial sense to build billion dollar platforms over active train tracks.
"This particular TEA snakes up from the West Side and includes Central Park...[T]he qualifying zone for Hudson Yards captures several census tracts in Harlem, where public housing projects boost the overall unemployment figure."
Fortunately the large percentage of public housing with high unemployment in neighboring areas was able to be used when drawing up the TEA boundaries.
In essence, completely legal and allowed within the letter of the law here.
Yeah, as I mentioned in another comment, it's totally legal - technically, they were able to daisychain together a number of census tracts, corner to corner, to make it look like a $28 billion luxury development was functionally and economically directly connected to Harlem. But many still think it breaks the spirit of the law, which is to spur investment in legitimately underdeveloped areas. I think there's a good case to be made whether a publicly subsidized financial services firm office in a tropy high rise directly benefits underdeveloped / underserved communities in Harlem.
you:
completely legal and allowed within the letter of the law here.
defpoints 2 comments up:
So even if it was legal, it seems to have violated the spirit of the program.
oh look, you both agree with each other.
It was distressed in the sense it was an industrial wasteland and largely unused before it was built. That change with what they built, which is clearly not designed for poor people, but the area was pretty derelict before.
A bunch of rich foreigners invested in this project instead of something else.
Hmm looks like they took ~$1.6b in funding (of about $25b total) so, relatively, $12.8mm of EB-5 Funding was used for the Vessel. That is dumb. However, idk if we should be so mad at the developers when it's in their best interest to spend the least money as possible. We should be very angry with the government for giving approval for this clearly-not-low-employment area.
Yeah, I'm so sick of "A companies job is to make money" used as an excuse to do shit things.
We need some kind of ethics code built into regulations for all companies. JFK.
"Haha oops we killed a bunch of people with unsafe auto parts that we knew about but calculated the lawsuits would cost less than a recall"
"Well to be fair they are incentivized to make money so that makes sense for them to do"
"If a system is corrupt, then the people who adhere to the system and are incentivized by that system are not criminals. They are victims, and the system itself must be tried."
-Dave Chapelle
That's complete nonsense. It's not black and white, where you're either Hitler or a Saint. If people keep exploiting others because the system encourages -- even demands -- it, then who will fix the system? Who will "put the system on trial"?
A system is just a bunch of rules. Rules can't do anything to anyone. It's the people who follow and enforce those rules who are causing the pain. If no one followed the system, there wouldn't be any system to put on trial.
Put another way, you can say the politicians who work to make the system worse are also innocent because the system gives them incentive to rise to power. It is absolutely the responsibility of the individual to make ethical choices. It may not lead to much, but it's not magically okay now to exploit others for your own profit.
Why would we not also be mad at the corrupt scumbag real estate developers that keep NYC/NY in general and state wide politics a corrupt shithole for decades? Developers rape this city over and over for a few bucks & then fuck the people over for another few bucks. We have a top Republican and a top Democrat state reps in prison over developer bribery. And those are the ones who were caught. Just because the politicians who approved this cash grab are scumbags doesn’t magically make the developers not scumbags.
“It’s not my fault I stole, it’s your fault for not catching me!”.
Huh....
Why should you be held responsible for a crime someone else noticed?
Edit- lmao guess y’all never heard of Bob Loblaw.
The government isn't the Futurama guy in the shut up and take my money gif. You don't think Related pressured the government into diverting this funding? It was clearly a stipulation in this project happening at all. We're not just talking about the Vessel here, it's just that this useless, now failing, structure is the embodiment of what's wrong with Hudson Yards in general
Instead of just admitting you were wrong you instead shift to "well can you blame them for trying to make money??"
Yikes
I think we can get mad at the developers AND the government. the state allowed Related to use money earmarked for low employment areas by linking together a convoluted string of census blocks to qualify, but Related actually took the money.
What a weird way to appreciate someone taking new, better information in and changing their mind. It’s almost as if you didn’t want them to learn and grow…
They don't, because that means they would have to grow up and act like an adult and realize people can change their views and opinions.
Who cares, 12 mil is relatively inexpensive and it’s a nice looking, arguably iconic piece of nyc now. Everyone benefits from a more attractive city
Seriously, millions of people (myself included) enjoy this every year. $13M is a small price to pay
13 million...for poor people, you mean?
But hey, as long as you enjoy it...
It doesn't help that the architects didn't fucking suicide proof this piece of shit. Just put glass instead of a shitty dingy fence ffs.
Ask an stadium or arena builder, why spend their money when they can get the taxpayer to spend theirs, just business as usual. I think people are of the misunderstanding that someone is actually responsible for taxpayer money to be equitably spent, it's comes in and then goes out to first at the trough. Poor, minorities, new citizens etc can't even get close enough to the trough to even see it.
If we had a society of window makers and window breakers it would very efficient at creating GDP. But nothing of real practical value would be created and people’s lives wouldn’t be improved. Just because people got paid doing something worthless doesn’t negate the good that could have been done with those man hours.
People jump off it, but at least other people made money out of it first. Wut?
I mean the suicides are sad but they aren't really relevant to this particular argument. Someone called these stairs a waste of money, the person you're replying to is arguing the money was spent on business and individuals where it will be re-spent and contribute to the economy.
Yeah i get it. All i can think about though, is red pavement below, and comments about the flow of economy above.
when was the last time a painting cost $200 million tax payer dollars to produce
When was the last time a painting produced potentially hundreds of jobs?
you could produce hundreds of jobs doing road work and probably cost like 150k
You asked when the last time a painting cost the taxpayers this much money, and I asked you when the last time a painting produced this many jobs. Are you now changing your argument from "it's a waste because art shouldn't cost this much" to "its a waste because we could have put the money somewhere more useful"?
was shown elsewhere that the project was part of 1.5b in government funding
Imagine thinking art can't be shit, and a waste of time and money.
Being art doesn't immediately make something good.
Imagine thinking the opinion of your own view is greater than the opinion of someone different
Nope not a void, just a 25 billion dollar neighborhood, aka the most expensive neighborhood in nyc. So glad the rich get to have their fancy playthings while the rest of us suffer. But hey, at least the workers got paid!
Actually that money would go to construction workers, which are typically not millionaires and would circulate the money
My point is that I live less than a mile from the Hudson Yards and there’s a good chance I’ll never even be able to afford to live there. I’m sick of this city bending over backwards for the rich to let them treat the city like it’s their personal shopping center and playground. Hell, the developers of the Hudson Yards skimmed $1.2 billion in public funding meant for impoverished neighborhoods through a legal loophole. And your argument is that it’s fine because some construction workers got paid so that people can look out from their $5,000 a month 1bed apartment and see a $200 million suicide honeycomb? Not to mention the pieces of the structure were fabricated in Italy so I guess we’re just talking about the construction workers who assembled it. With the amount of issues facing this city after the pandemic, that’s pretty much a void to me. I’m obviously not saying construction workers shouldn’t get paid, but they could have been paid to do so many other things that would actually benefit people. As a New Yorker, it’s so tiring to see shit like this celebrated.
All the money that went into that project could have been put to better use literally anywhere. Feed the homeless, affordable housing, etc.
Edit: holy cow the amount of negativity in this comment section is absolutely crazy. I I don't care about the down votes, what I do care about is people attacking my character for a comment I made in passing. I saw the post, commented and left. Now I'm getting continuous comments about how shitty of a person I am. I wasn't saying that this project didnt help the people who built it. I was simply saying that money could (in my opinion) be used for something better. Hope you all have a blessed day.
I just skimmed through the first article and it never mentions stolen money. I’ll have a deeper read once I’m home, but from my initial reading of your own sources, it seems that you’ve conflated a controversial source of funds with stolen funds.
Edit : appreciate you looking for sources and posting these though. That’s a way higher bar than most discussions on Reddit meet, and the first article you posted seems very interesting.
Considering this project would only be a few dollars, if not a few cents of your personal taxes, it is pretty comparable. If you believe the government is misusing your taxes then you can vote for them to be decreased and reallocate the money in a way you find appropriate. Every time my taxes go down I find a way to put that money towards things like feeding homeless people, fighting capital punishment, or funding the volunteer fire department because these are things I care about.
Well it certainly helps keep the people involved in the project and their families in homes and with food, and it helps people who are working across buildings with their jobs so that they can stay off the streets and donate to homeless charity themselves. But then this is subjective. If you think simply giving the homeless food and shelter without a well-defined return value is a better use of money, this could work too.
I wasn't actually suggesting anything. I was just making a statement, an opinion if you will. You can find a positive and negative with my comment and all the other comments about this project feeding families, etc.
you say using your fancy phone or computer, that you dont need, and could have used said money helping the needy. Get over your virtue signaling foolishness
Um... I work helping recovering addicts who are homeless get clean, find jobs and a place to stay. Just because I have a phone ( I've had the same one for several years now) doesn't mean I don't do my part to help people out. I hope you find freedom from your anger and resentment. Peace.
It technically did. The construction workers fed their families and kept a roof over their head for the construction of it. And still does with maintenance.
Look I'm not saying "Fuck the people who built this thing, they don't deserve a salary" I'm saying that this amount of money could help a lot more people out than what it was spent on. I mean for gods sake its closed a majority of the time because people are using it to kill themselves. Thats great it helped people with jobs out, I'm not bashing that.
Seeing as the money was taken from a project that was supposed to help low income neighborhoods in the first place I’d have to agree. https://hyperallergic.com/494907/the-financing-of-hudson-yards-is-worse-than-its-architecture/
Funny how the dude below you said the exact same thing yet you got downvoted. People on Reddit aren’t too smart.
I don't really care lol. I get art and stuff but a $200 million dollar stair case is a bit much. $200 million dollars could really make a difference if it was used towards helping the homeless population eat, bathe, and have safe housing.
All that money was used by engineers, architects, contractors, installers buying made in china crap
It was made in Italy and transported in six pieces by ship over 15 days, then reassembled in NYC.
Awfully high and mighty there, casting the first stone. Tell me, what profession is that not true of these days?
Good thing the planet has infinite resources for make-work projects.
Those people could have works elsewhere, and they all could have made a hospital or something.
This is the worst possible defense for throwing away time and money.
Thats patently false. Most buildings serve some function other than a tourist trap.
Apartment buildings are living spaces.
Office buildings are working spaces.
Retail are retail.
Art exhibits are basically something for tourists to gawk at.
There is no ‘broken window’. The money spent has to serve some function or it is a net waste of money.
This is what I tell people about the billionaires going to space. It's not like they launch that money into the ether
That’s a fallacy, you don’t make money building dumb crap and fixing stuff that’s broken. Broken window fallacy.
The people at the top, the 1%, got most of the profit from that. The money was taken from funds meant to help low income areas.
That's a nothing argument. The money obviously would have gone to contractors matter what was built, so it's completely disingenuous to use that as a justification. That money was specifically intended to be used for projects to help poor neighborhoods, not to build shit-heap tourist traps that benefit no one but the builders.
My hometown recently spent something like 18 million in taxpayers money on an avant-garde Piglet statue where the colors only line up if the sun hits it just right. Barely looks like Piglet.
Its terrible and got tons of push back, but gentrification stops for no man, woman, or child. It's not like our homelessness is spiralling out of control or anything
That's the one. I always loved all the Winnie the Pooh characters, but from the bottom of my heart, fuck you Piglet
There was an article about this recently saying how there are other buildings, like the Guggenheim, that have open staircases and no suicides because it is actually an attractive building. This thing is just a vanity project. Also when this was either first proposed or first opened it was mentioned that people would jump and the architects were idiots for not taking that into account. The person who wrote that review recently said they were never so sad to be right.
Why are these stairs inherently more dangerous in people wanting to commit suicide compared to regular bridges?
Jumping onto concrete is a much better way to ensure death than jumping into water
you cant casually stroll down a lot of bridges, its awkward getting to the edge, cant take a cab right up to it. stuff like that. just a guess. Like harder to get to, people are too lazy to actually do it.
Yeah unless they have a pedestrian path and a low railing it’s not exactly easy to access to actually jump. And a lot of bridges aren’t high enough to actually kill at consistency a jumper would want. They want to escape life not be crippled. So to them it needs to guarantee the kill.
I'm not sure that this creates more suicides than there would be if it never existed. It's just a place to do it but it doesn't actively cause anyone to off themselves.
That's interesting. My first thought was how many people will commit suicide here as I entered the newly opened Groningen Forum in the Netherlands. Look it up.
Agreed. Many times I need a staircase and can't find one because the rich people are hoarding all the staircases.
We all down here trying to climb the career ladder, when rich people have staircases!
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It’d be less frustrating if the same companies spending all this money on stairs weren’t also underpaying their employees. If you pay your employees well, give them good benefits, vacation etc. then yeah, go ahead and drop on some dumb shit, but if you’re pinching pennies on your workers, fuck you for spending $200,000,000 on stairs.
It’s time like this that I remember that Reddit is run by 16 year olds
Good job, you've pointed out something bad. How do you suggest we fix it? Do you have an effective and efficient replacement for the world's most durable building materials?
I'm fine with rich people spending their money on stupid shit, as long as it's not harmful to the planet...
Unfortunately, concrete, steel, glass, and plastic making are all pretty bad for the environment.
Then you who couldn't remember two comments in one go replied with this drivel
Good job, you've pointed out something bad. How do you suggest we fix it? Do you have an effective and efficient replacement for the world's most durable building materials?
The complaint isn't that the material were used fullstop nor especially was it about their use when building important and necessary things, it's that this was some rich person's "stupid shit" that was "harmful to the planet".
Maybe read a few books so two comments isn't too big of a challenge for your memory making you forget simple context leading to an irrelevant and wrong gotcha moment.
I saw you were a different person, I'm just obviously not used to even slight encouragement online.
I was thinking more along the lines of don’t build what you don’t need, like a giant suicide staircase. Other than that you can draw up plans that minimize use of those materials. All but plastic can be recycled for use in similar types of materials. Plastic recycling usually ends up in a downgraded product.
That’s not how the money system works. You literally can’t ‘hoard’ it. Money is always in circulation.
I have $2,000 in a bank account that hasn’t moved in over 20 years. I don’t use it when I consider purchases. I don’t consider it when I need cash. I just keep it there, not even in a high-interest account, so it isn’t being invested in any substantial way. That money does absolutely nothing for anybody except for maybe my bank, but even that’s negligible. I don’t help the economy. I don’t help businesses. I don’t help myself. I just store that money. I have taken that money out of circulation. It is hoarded in my bank account.
Now imagine I have tens of billions of dollars. How much might I hoard then? What might that amount of money do if it’s injected into the economy?
Not to mention the lack of taxes paid by such individuals
2 problems.
Banks only reserve a small percentage of funds and loan out the rest. So most of your $2k is circulating through the economy as we speak.
Billionaires don’t keep billions in the bank. They own stock, which most of time started out worth $0 and grew in value (created out of thin air btw) into the number (which is literally just a calculation based on two other numbers) that you now perceive them to be ‘hoarding’.
I don’t want to be rude here but your entire position is predicated on fundamentally incorrect assumptions of how finance and economics works. And it’s really really annoying that that causes you (generalized) to push for economic policies that will literally make things worse for most people.
Let’s ignore you being an incorrect ass, and I will apologize for daring to criticize people with unlimited lines of credit based off of stock value created through labor they actively fuck over and is used for things like yachts and spaceships that have negligible impact on the general population while also spending millions in dollars to avoid paying taxes, which actually would have a direct benefit to the populace, an effect which, time and time again, has actually been proven to stimulate the economy and promote general growth.
Well right now his deposits are being dumped into Reverse Repos every night - there were one trillion dollars in RRPs issued today. The banks are flush with customer cash and nowhere to invest it because the stock market and the bond markets are inflated to all hell and everyone knows it.
The stock market by-and-large doesn't create jobs.
You’re right but reddit won’t like it.
Bezos doesn’t have 200B dollar bills under a mattress that nobody else can have. He owns 51.7 million little pieces of Amazon that a hell of a lot of people want to buy from him.
And that’s not even getting into the fact that wealth is no static, and is not zero sum. Total wealth goes up constantly.
For a real mind bender, every single person on the planet can become wealthier even while the wealth gap rises.
Well, the Statue of Liberty was a gift from France and the Empire State building has housed countless businesses and workers over the 90 years since it opened. So, no neither of them were wastes of money.
But the Vessel?
Yeah, huge waste of money. No offices, no workers, keeps getting shut down because the only use for the thing is to provide a convenient place to off one's self. I don't really see a big return on the investment coming from that.
Statue of Liberty from France, The Vessel from Italy.
No workers? It didn't autonomously self-assemble.
No ROI? It's purpose is to attract visitors to Hudson Yards and from its 75,000 visitors per day, I'd say it's doing okay there.
EDIT: No idea how many visitors, but <50-75k
The Vessel was not a gift from Italy. The pieces were manufactured there and shipped to the US.
How many offices does the Vessel house? The Empire State Building has roughly 20,000 tenants.
And the Vessel keeps getting closed because of the suicides, 5 months in early '21 and counting. The risk of suicide is so high they won't even allow people to visit it alone, you have to be in a group.... or rather you would have to be in a group, if you could visit it, because it's closed.
>75,000+ visitors per day,
I don't know where you go that figure, but from what I could find... "While its" [The Vessel] "visitor traffic on its opening weekend rivaled that of Rockefeller Center, the better-established Midtown attraction easily outdrew Hudson Yards on most weekends after that, typically attracting between 50,000 and 75,000 visits each day."
That's Rockefeller Center drawing 50-75k per day, not the Vessel.
The Empire State Building and Rockefeller Center are Art Deco buildings built in 1930's, not brutalist 60's office buildings, but I get your joke.
If your in New York to visit a building go to freedom tower. Specifically the museum in the basement
It's had 4 suicides but has only closed twice from it. Opened may 2019. Last suicide was a 14 year old. It doesn't really keep getting closed but it'd likely will in the future.
Yep, I misread. I have no idea how many people visit, but it's been packed every time I've been in the area.
It's an attraction, not an office building. So? You're talking ROI, which likely is favorable. That also makes the distinction of whether it was a paid, commissioned work or a gift less important.
On suicides, ESB is certainly not immune with what, 30? Steps should be taken to mitigate them at The Vessel. You don't destroy a public art display, a building, a bridge, etc because of it.
if they wanted to make some money theyd put bars and restaurants and shit up and down it
Making the world a bit cooler and prettier isn't a waste of money
Every building is a waste of money. We should go back to Stone Age and spend our energy and time only on hunting
Oh ofcourse lets just have pure brutalism architecture with no design or meaning other than saving money.
Sure. If we wanted to waste no money we could all live in gray boxes, drive the same car, and work in bigger gray boxes, but some people are willing to spend more for things that look nice.
Art certainly has its place in society and is undervalued. But I don't think some art is worth it's price. I'd argue a balloon dog Isn't worth fucking 60mil $.
Imagine how boring our infrastructure would be if people like you were in charge lmao. Or imagine how many historic buildings wouldn't exist if the builders were worried about it being a "waste" of money l.
Imagine thinking taxpayers paid for this when it is widely known the real estate company who owns the property paid for it in full and let’s the public use it for free?
How does that cost anywhere near US$200Million? Maybe the people jumping off the thing are the ones who had to pay for it.
Imagine designing a specialized structure for assisting suicide and people in charge keep shutting it down.
Suicide is usually an impulsive act, and jumpers tend to be drawn to landmark places where a quick death is virtually guaranteed. Of course you could rent a room with a balcony in a very tall hotel building and jump off that, but that's less impulsive. The public attention that's given to suicides that occur at landmarks can also attract other suicidal people. So famous bridges, observation towers, etc. will often have some kind of suicide prevention measures like enclosures or nets.
Honestly, I do think the designers should have anticipated that something like this would become a suicide hotspot, and that it would be virtually impossible to secure the structure without compromising its aesthetics.
Damn I guess we shouldn't have built the golden gate bridge then
Sure, take precautions. But there are people here that want the vessel demolished because of suicides which is insane
Medical treatment should be assisted instead. Free treatment for people who need it.
The jumpers kinda selfish ngl. Man just wanna see cool lookin stairs.
I'm all for mental health, but the random tourists at the attraction in the middle of the day did nothing to deserve you throwing your suicide on them.
Because when life has driven you to that point, clearly the only thing you think about is others.
This is the same shit as telling the people with suicidal thoughts to think about their family. It doesn’t help them at all and you’re basically telling them their only reason to live is for others pleasure.
You killing yourself doesn’t give you free pass to fuck up other people. I’m sorry but I’m not going to cut you this slack because you want to die that you get a free pass to do whatever you want on the way out.
Of all the reasons on why you should stop a person from killing themselves, this is your main one?
Like, what are you going to do? Put them in prison.
I wasn’t even saying it’s okay, I just wanted to explain why people do it.
Their easy way out should be free therapy and medicine to actually help them, with medical euthanasia considered for chronic pain and allowed if its untreatable and also allowed for things like terminal illness or dementia/Alzheimer’s where they’re definitely going to die from it and probably die painfully.
If we can help them thrive that should be a priority.
Otherwise people who don’t need to or even want to die will kill themselves over a temporary episode. When I get overwhelmed by sensory issues I sometimes hurt myself, it would be dangerous for me to have easy access to that for everyone with no barriers and no actual help.
If you disagree that only tells me you’re just pretending to care.
The guy who built/paid for it is who wants to shut it down after a 14 year old jumped from the top level a few weeks back.
They tried raising the railings, tripled security, trained security/staff in warning signs of suicide and how to speak to someone considering it, put signs up everywhere offering free help if suicidal, changed the admission to at least 2 people per group because jumpers came alone.
But then this 14 year old with a history of suicide attempts came in from NJ with his mom, dad and little sister. They went to the top. He was playing with his little sister (iirc, she’s 10) then he launched himself off right in front of his family.
Really sad shit. Obviously, people might just commit suicide elsewhere but the public being subjected to seeing someone jump/die on the structure and on the ground is a horrific trauma, but there’s also the danger a falling person poses to bystanders.
So between all that and the fact that most of us locals hated it and the suicides made it more hateable, the guy shutting it down for everyone’s safety is a big ass relief.
And rip the people below that may get hit, and peace to those living with PTSD after witnessing a suicide
As morbid as it sounds, in a way, that's kind of a compliment. People that want to end their lives seeking out the structure you created to give their final act whatever meaning they are imagining at the time.
Maybe they could put some images or words somewhere that might help people reconsider their decision or reevaluate what lead them to that point. Maybe a phone that when you pick it up there's someone on the other end to help them.
Ya for reals. If I was gonna kill myself I'd splatter my brains on the mayor's house instead. I'd hate to traumatize innocent people, or even worse, land on one.
I’ll probably get downvoted to hell for this, but committing suicide in public areas has always seemed like wanting attention to me. Like I realize they just don’t care anymore and want to get it over with, but it’s traumatizing as hell for people who see it. While I’d rather people not commit suicide at all, there’s definitely ways to do it without traumatizing other people. I can only imagine what the 10 year old girl felt when her brother who was just playing with her felt when he threw himself off the top of stairs.
committing suicide in public areas has always seemed like wanting attention to me
I think that's a fair assessment. When a Buddhist monk sets themself on fire they are certainly doing it for the attention. I don't necessarily consider the attention seeking part of it to be a bad thing, although in some cases it definitely is. I believe there are some cases where the benefits to shining a light on a situation outweigh the collateral damage. I'm not willing to try to generalize that assertion or try to romanticize suicide though. It's just that some people have their reasons.
Everyone knew this would happen the minute its design was revealed. Kind of incredible that they went ahead with it, without major revisions
You're still not thinking big enough. We need a wood chipper that empties into a conveniently placed dumpster with the doors off. Or a man-sized garbage disposal that drains directly into the sewer.
Just one of those giant skydiving fans to launch them into an impoverished neighborhood so we aren't bothered
Oh damn. I think this idea is the winner. Like with everything else in life, let the poors figure it out.
why not just make a quantum computer that uses every single person's mental health history to predict when they will commit suicide and where they will land if they jump off this staircase so they can make a manhole where people will land and move the manhole to the next predicted position.
Maybe Apple can pitch in some extra employee nets from China
It'd be interesting if they marked a target which secretly functioned as a net below the surface. Then they sign an NDA to get out.. and as we know, most jumpers are regretful of the whole thing.
In any case, it's better here than in front of a subway train (i.e. the usual).
I’ve always assumed that any leapers have to change their minds on the way down. “Idon’tcarethatmywifecheatedonmeohshiiiiiit…”
That's pretty much what I recall as a synopsis of the study. The problems they had would pass (e.g. if they just left it all and started anew) and they feel new clarity on that.. but the problem of accelerating towards death will not.
It takes money to start over, that's the problem.
Not everyone can afford a $1200 one bedroom apartment after a divorce or break-up.
If they completed the jump, how would you know they regretted it?
There are a lot of jumpers, and hence occasional survivors. Of course there's likely some selection bias since the ones more serious about it would tend to jump from greater heights and land on harder surfaces..
A lot of those come from the Golden Gate Bridge jump. Which is 99% fatal unless you hit the water just right like a professional high diver would.
And also a bit of reverse psychology as it could be the open manhole cover to hell
Would you make it that far center? I would jump on the outside overhang.
What about going bungee jumping off it but just dont attach the cord to the railing?
Man, life insurance might even pay off for accident.
A guy could do a pretty decent gainer off that. I know a couple base jumpers who would probably jump from the structure with the intent of living, too. But that's probably illegal in New York.
That's pretty far in to be a realistic target, but logic might not be all that relevant.
At only 150ft to the ground? You’re gonna need a BASE setup. Horrifying!
Seriously: if they built an amazing slide I bet the number of suicides would plumm-... massively decrease.
"I could kill myself but... then I'd never get to experience that awesome looking slide."
You know. It's not a completely crazy idea. I mean, it is, but it could still work. When i was suicidal it was the little things that kept me alive. "Will the world end 2012", "i have to see the next marvel movie" etc. Although i guess it's important that the slide isn't disappointing because then they will just walk up there again.
Never been suicidal, but I kinda get this because I have pretty significant bouts of depression, and it's honestly the little things that keep me going through the week.
Get a hug from my daughter, play a game of Mage Knight, discover a really tasty craft beer, put my feet in my daughter's kiddie pool on a hot day and read a book while she splashes around, watch a funny movie with my wife, that perfectly brewed cup of coffee.
That's the stuff that makes life.
I don't think so. Its closed currently because a 14-year-old jumped.
It's the first result if you google "the vessel", and it's closed indefinitely.
Honestly I hate this thing. I love the design, but it was privately funded and the billionaire (Stephen Ross) who paid for it refuses to make the barriers higher because it'll make the view worse. The architect submitted designs for higher barriers after the 2nd suicide just to have them ignored.
LoL, no worries. I was just curious where this beautiful staircase is located. I don't know why people want to ruin it with suicides.What a pity.
Probably something to do with not giving a single fuck about what you think.
Add some cargo nets connecting from top till bottom, and you'll have a $200m playground.
I never thought id see the day where an emoji wouldn't be downvoted to hell
Your cheap labeling is sooo boring! Come on, if you want to insult me at least show some originality.
If I recall my catholic instruction on suicide, it doesn't. for them at least that's on their auto-disqualification list (or was).
Have not churched in 20 years so grain of salt.
I'll take "Places That Should've Just Been a Map In a Video Game" for $500 Alex
i ctrl+f'd halo 3 and wasnt not disappointed, i knew someone with a large brain already connected this image to halo :)
Make for a great boss arena, big thing pulsating in the middle, smashes stairs as you ascend
This reminds me of Nintendo Land's Metroid Blast level called "Sea Tower."
Yeah what the fuck is this? It literally goes no where. It’s connected to nothing.
A couple months ago I paid their entry fee to walk several flights of stairs. As a solo visitor you were not allowed to wander around by yourself because they were afraid of people jumping off. There were about 8 of us in my group with one guide. I'm curious how this most recent person timed it, but in reality even in a group it'd take about half a second to fling yourself over the side and there's nothing anyone could do about it.
A different commenter mentioned the most recent death was a 14 y/o kid who was with his mother and younger sister. The two siblings were running around playing, and somehow he got to the 8th floor and jumped.
i think being in a group with someone doesnt only mean that someone will try to stop you from committing suicide, but someone's presence will deter you from doing it in the first place. or, if anything, it will make you postpone it for some other time and place, at which point theyre satisfied and its not their problem anymore.
wait this structure is just stairs?!? I thought it housed retail or restaurants.. wow.
There’s buildings around with stuff, but this structure is just the stairs
This specific structure is just stairs, yup. It’s apart of a massive complex thingy though that has tons of retail and restaurants, this was just meant to be the centerpiece of it (ex Cloud Gate/“the Bean” in Chicago).
Tons is being a bit generous. The Neiman Marcus, which was supposed to be their flagship tenant, closed last summer. It’s doing about as well as any mall anywhere else in America these days
Well yea, “tons” in terms of any other mall or entertainment complex in America. Doing about as well as American Dream across the water, which is to say “surviving by modern standards”
I was there a few weeks ago. Tons seems about right to me. The mall was full of stores (extremely expensive ones so not much shopping going on) and absolutely packed, along with the whole area around the Vessel.
Is the Spanish food mart and restaurant still alive? That was nice.
funds meant for "rural" or "distressed urban" areas suffering from high unemployment.
In the middle of fucking Manhattan.
Not all Manhattan is the same. At the time this was built the area was literally abandoned warehouses and railyards. Nobody lived there, no economic activity was there. It was the definition of distressed.
As someone who actually lives there that’s so blantantly false. NYC is still one of the safest major cities to visit in the world. Crime went up with the pandemic like it did literally everywhere.
You have a greater chance of being a victim of crime in Springfield, MO than you do in the vast majority NYC.
It amazing how incompetent government programs are. On the one hand, I feel the government needs to do more to address societal problems, on the other, they already do a terrible job with the spending they do
The structure was privately funded by developer Related.
Maybe money laundering too? What a waste of fucking 200 million.
Remember when that was a joke on the Simpsons? The escalator to nowhere? And remember when the mayor being a pervert was also a joke in Simpsons?
Before you shit on our city make sure you’re familiar with the fundamentals. This wasn’t built by us. This was built by a private property owner.
STG, Reddit bumpkins love jumping on NY & LA over anything but never know wtf they’re talking about lmaooo
And you have to pay for it like an attraction. It’s in between shops and office.
No you don't, just have to reserve a spot in advance. I went like a yr and a half ago
They added an entrance fee to pay for security guards to try and prevent the suicides.
I just looked it up, and its still free for the first hour and then its 10 bucks after that. Kinda weird system i guess? Doesn't even matter tho cos its closed now lol
Seems like a recipe for accidents. Imagine people rushing down those stairs because they don't want to be charged $10 for staying for over an hour.
It was something to do for the day I guess, but its just a shit ton of stairs and an okay view at the top.
Get people to climb more stairs to be healthier. Nah, probably not that
Yeah thats how it was, now its free the first hour thwyre open and then its $10 for the rest of the hours. But its closed cos people keep killing themselves
Just to the right of this is a Mall/Food Hall type of place. It doesn't directly house retail or restaurants, but I'm sure it was meant as an attractor to add to the experience of visiting those retail/restaurants.
That whole parcel of land is just one big spending flex. It’s built on top of an active rail yard (hence the name) and its hollow underneath, it’s basically a floating platform with massive buildings on top.
Don’t get me wrong - is it an incredible engineering feat? Yes. Are the views dope? Yeah, my mom’s office has a complete 360 view of the city. Is a complete waste for a couple of fancy office buildings while there’s thousands of homeless people in NYC? Absolutely.
I agree and I was myself making them the other day. It just so striking how jaded and cynical we all are. Probably why Ted Lasso is so beloved hah
For reddit everything thing is a joke to them, like literally. I can't even remember the last time there wasn't joke comments in a thread that is on r/all. Shit gets really really old.
I think a surprisingly large amount also don’t care if someone commits suicide or trying to prevent it. I know some people like that irl who aren’t even hiding behind a screen.
I mean there time and place not joke about everything especially place like this.
Also reddit humor is shit anyway so I would be glad is they implemented joke police
Also reddit humor is shit anyway so I would be glad is they implemented joke police
THIS! SO MUCH THIS! Came here to say that!
This corresponds to one of my deepest fears. It is absolutely terrifying, I regularly have nightmares walking on this kind of stairs.
Me too. Had a dream like this less than a week ago, recurring over the course of my life.
I barely missed seeing the actual jump from my window. Didn’t realize what all the ambulances and cop cars that were rushing in were for until later when I saw the haz mat team cleaning the site.
With that name and design I can't help but to feel all these suicides are sacrifices demanded by the machine god.
It doesn't look like this in real life. This picture is a fisheye or panorama or something. In real life it's stupid ugly.
Just saw this in the Olympics.
I'll bet you could get to 9 or 10 full flips.
In all seriousness that sucks for both the srtist and the victims
$200,000,000 might have saved a few people let's be honest
Also cruel joke for wheelchair bound people
Surely the Onion has done a headline on this, right?
I was there the weekend it opened and the elevator and the "shaft" was built into the structure so it wasn't added in later.
Yup, I wasn't being sarcastic
I mean I love architecture as much as the next nerd( concept art was what defined my career)... but seriously?
Use it for something else. A pamphlet would do the job to promote (insert whoever purchased it here)
Fuck Thomas Heatherwick, the guy is a crook who was part of the rigged Garden Bridge project in London. Heatherwick, Boris Johnson and Joanna Lumley should be rotting in prison. £40m of taxpayers money just disappeared and it was an elitist bullshit project. Not forgetting that garbage ‘B for Bang’ sculpture he did in Manchester that also in the end got scrapped because it was dangerous.
New Yorkers got scammed into paying $200m for a big chicken shawarma staircase.
The whole thing is surprisingly accessible actually. The inclined elevator system is really cool and frankly just as interesting as the rest of the structure even if you can't explore all the levels.
The whole thing is surprisingly accessible actually.
you can't explore all the levels.
I can’t believe how far I had to scroll to see somebody thinking the same thing.
This isn’t made up of anything essential. It’s just a fucking staircase. They could’ve put in a less fancy staircase, or just stuck with elevators. Even fancy hotels that seem unnecessarily luxurious can argue that they garner tourists to help boost the economy… but a fucking staircase? What tourists are doing anything but snapping a photo and passing it?
There’s literally no need for this. That money could’ve saved lives. $200 million should never go to something that “looks cool” period.
It’s for the wrong reasons, but I’m glad this seems to be in the process of never being used again (if the other comments aren’t lying).
Shame on the architect. Shame on anybody who financed this. What a waste of money.
The architect is just the designer. They're an artist who needed to make a living and probably had little to do with everything else.
You need to say "shame on anyone who approved on the overall project"
How the heck was it 200M? That’s the cost of a gigantic project, like building a factory or subdivision. This looks like it’s just…. stairs.
That's $12m per story.
The tallest building in the world was $1.5b in Dubai I think. So 7.5 of these could buy that (using your discount slave labour membership card).
It's also 154 stories. So about £9.7m per story and it comes with stairs too.
And what stopped them from using American steelwork and saving on the overseas freight costs?
To get people into the area. The Vessel was the big draw to get people into the Hudson Yards area of Manhattan after it had be developed into a much nicer state than it was previously in before all the new shops, apartments, and what not got built up.
Most people considering actually going through with suicide, like in the moment, are usually in a temporary crisis. Deterring them in that moment is usually enough to save their life so they can hopefully get help. I forgot what city it was, but they added barriers to the 2 most used bridges and suicides dropped overall by 30%.
Wait that actually makes a lot of sense, I tried once but I caught myself because I felt like my brother was going to find me in the morning and I couldn’t let myself hurt him like that
but they added barriers to the 2 most used bridges and suicides dropped overall by 30%.
Are you sure the overall suicides dropped, or just suicides on those particular bridges? If the people decided to go to Walmart and buy a gun for suicide instead of jumping off that doesn't really help.
IIRC the Brooklyn Bridge is a favourite spot for suicides. Also, people have used the Empire State Building before, that's why they have huge fencing on the observation deck now.
There is actual science behind this. People will actually avoid suicide without certain triggers. It sounds messed up but it's been studied heavily..
Surely they’re just jumping from somewhere else?
It's actually often the opposite. A lot of suicides are impulsive - the person may have had passive suicidal ideation for a while, but the actual decision to do it is often heat of the moment and triggered by some sort of temporary crisis. That's the whole idea behind nets/fencing at popular jumping spots, a lot of people turn back when they encounter a barrier at one spot and they don't have a plan B or don't attempt to go somewhere else.
Oh 100%, but can’t go solving the root of the problem, just gotta make sure it won’t bother you and make it someone else’s
Im all for investing in mental health and community outreach programs. But this was. Privately funded project on commercial land. "Not our problem" is 100% a valid response. I dont expect my local Costco to invest their money in funding suicide hotlines instead of adding a flower bed out front.
It sounds cold but lets rephrase things. "A bunch of people keep killing themselves on the artwork in front of a business and now people want to hold the business responsible for their deaths"
Arguably, suicide is solving the root of the problem. Once you do it, you can't do it again
when it's a "tourist attraction" and part of that is seeing humans flying in the air transforming themselves into spaghetti - it makes sense that they would shut it down. You'd think it would take more than 4 cases though.
I'm just going to say it. I like the Vessel. It looks great and it provides utility by serving as 360° viewing platform for Manhattan, Hudson Yards, and the river. You may argue it's a waste of money but any urban development in Manhattan is crazy expensive and having a nice, public, walkable area and iconic structure instead of a place to store old railway cars is a net win in my books.
Might be a "waste" of 200M but it was never my money to begin with.
I like that it brings back the idea of spectacle in architecture. Not everything has to be a banal boring piece of shit. it was paid for privately, why not enjoy it for what it is.
Wouldn’t people from NY have to pay for this? I have no idea how else this would be funded.
They got some, and guess what? The businesses that are now in that area are increasing tax revenue for the city that they wouldn’t have otherwise generated.
Okay, cool. I'm not against public funding, I'm saying it's misleading to say this was privately funded.
Im from south america and went to NYC last year. Actually the vessel was on our itinerary (only took pictures from the outside, tickets were “sold out” for that day) and we ate at the fancy mall and bought stuff there! It’s very interesting thinking what was on that place a few years ago
Ya would have been nice if he used it to buy some tractors for agricultural development in Africa,, but that's not going to make me hate it for what it is.
I’m under 5’ and I still felt uncomfortable being next to the railings for fear of falling over (granted, heights make me nervous).I think they were only about waist high ... which feels even shorter when you’re ascending or descending stairs right next to the barrier
Every single high floor landmark in NYC has fences or very tall glass. When people saw the plans for the Vessel many were concerned about the railings not being high enough. But because this was a private project the developer didn't incorporate this feedback into the design.
They should have made it more like a garden like the High Line, I really liked the Vessel when they were building it but they managed to turn the area gaudy and kitchy, with food tracks, trashy murals and "upscale" mall.
I did the census in Hudson Yards, the penthouses are upward of $30 million and the handyman who accompanied me on my interviews told me the elevator buttons are self cleaning nano-technology. It was a ghost town with very low occupancy. I once went to a building ( not Hudson yards but new construction in Chelsea ) and only three families from 800 units lived there, the rest foreign investors - second or maybe fiftieth property.
It frustrates me that there is a non-zero number of people who think building a staircase to nowhere is a good idea but things like a pedestrian bridge from New Jersey to Manhattan can't get traction.
https://www.libertybridge.org/
https://jerseydigs.com/the-highline-has-nothing-on-jersey-citys-new-pedestrian-bridge/
I can see why Jersey City wants that, seems like there's not really anything to sell it to Manhattan though.
Americans will fund literally anything before improving non-car-traffic lol
That argument makes no sense for the NY metro area, the one place in America with a shit ton of public transportation that’s always undergoing improvements.
That’s an expensive ass bridge when the PATH or the ferry are options to get across without using a car. Am I totally against the bridge? No, but it’s quite an expensive investment for what would essentially be a third option (or fourth, I think you can bike through the tunnels).
EDIT: I misread the comment I'm replying to. Missed the "non-" which literally completely flips what I thought I was responding to. Original comment below.
Have you seen the state of public transit in this country? You NEED to take a car to get literally anywhere. It's the only infrastructure we bother to build around. In most of Dallas we don't even have sidewalks yet endure gridlocked traffic daily.
Americans in cities want an alternative to spending hours stuck in traffic. Biking is faster than driving if there's a wide sidewalk or bike lane and in some cases like Manhattan even walking can be faster.
Drivers should support these projects as well, as they reduce traffic by removing vehicles from the road more than any street widening could add capacity.
Yeah, this is the correct answer. It's not like the city built it and there would be a whole other mess of complications to get privately funded infrastructure built and maintained.
You know how god damn far away GW is from fucking Jersey City you pigeon?
The proposed Liberty Budge would connect Jersey City to Battery Park.
Negligible number of people are going to use it to commute
Why? The Brooklyn bridge has 4,000 cyclists and 10,000 pedestrians per day. Is that negligible? Some people move to Brooklyn because they are able to travel to Manhattan but can't afford rent in the city. This would be longer, but it would make it possible to commute without rail bus or car. Right now that's an impediment to some who could otherwise choose to live on the jersey side.
A Google search says 120,000 cars cross the Brooklyn bridge per day. That means pedestrians and bicyclists make up around 5% of bridge users.
So? You only want to build a bridge if it also accommodates car traffic? AFAIK it's not feasible to put a car path there. It greatly increases and complicates the footprint of the bridge. The layout of the neighborhoods won't accommodate it.
This is like the Highline or Liberty State park along the waterfront. It exists for people to use and enjoy. Except this also facilitates new transport options.
I was arguing against the unsupported statement that no one would use the bridge. Saying that the Brooklyn bridge facilitates more cars than people is besides the point.
I'm simply putting your numbers into context. I'm very pro-bicycle infrastructure but I'm just guessing 1-2 billion dollars in green/public infrastructure could be spent in much better ways. But I'm not from New York so they can do whatever they want.
I mean the bridge has six lanes for traffic and one 10ft ish span for pedestrians and bikes so it's not surprising that car traffic is like an order of magnitude greater. I'd guess that if the bridge has more space for pedestrians / bikes (and those spaces we're separated) use would increase. Particularly for bikes.
The port authority just finished the new Goethals spans, which is famtastic, but that doesn't mean they couldn't do this as well.
"Hey boss, lots of people are killing themselves from these stairs. Should we address the mental health crisis we are facing by examining the underlying causes and investing in communities?"
"Nah fuck it, just close the 200m dollar project. They can kill themselves somewhere else."
"Hey boss, lots of people are killing themselves from these stairs. Should we address the mental health crisis we are facing by examining the underlying causes and investing in communities?"
"We are a New York City real estate development company Bob. Wtf are you talking about?"
Maybe that 200 million would have been better spent on mental health or just supporting people's basic needs
Yes they jumped off these to end their life.
That is the evidence their needs were not being met
Exactly. Just cuz someone seems successful to other people doesn't mean they're healthy/happy. Depression, anxiety, PTSD, BPD, they're all so hard to notice if you aren't dealing with them.
(I would really recommend anyone who sees this to do research into the correlation between high grades and depression in students, or even suicide attempts. They're much more related than the average parent would think, and it's a good thing to keep an eye out for the people you know and try to make changes)
I know I made a joke about This being a Halo map further down but this is the real conversation we should all be having.
Imagine the dude creating this.
"It'll be the staircase that reaches to the heavens."
And then people used it to actually go to heaven.
I know at least the two most recent suicides did not jump into the middle. They jumped to the outside.
Not to be too gruesome, but I was literally minutes from seeing the last one happen in real time. Came home from walking the dog and saw the ambulances and cop cars pulling up from my window. If we’d gotten home a couple minutes earlier it’s likely I would have seen the kid falling.
Yea, I was making light of a horrible situation, but that sucks. Sorry that you're subjected to living so close to somewhere that happens so often.
Not just any $200 million staircase, but a $200 million staircase that leads to nowhere.
If I like this post am I liking it because people are committing suicides or because it's a cool looking staircase or because the post is just interesting? I'm so confused right now.
Suicides or not, that is one of the most impractical staircases I’ve ever seen. Definitely put appearance over practicality.
well yeah, it's more accessible than a bridge. It's also a beautiful art installation. I hope this doesn't cause it to get shut down permanently.
I was thinking of The Golden Gate Bridge, now I'm on the fence
Damn you got there quick
Imagine spending $200 million on stairs that nobody can use and living in a city where majority of people can't afford rent or other basic necessities on minimum wage or even $15/hr
National Suicide Prevention Lifeline
We can all help prevent suicide. The Lifeline provides 24/7, free and confidential support for people in distress, prevention and crisis resources for you or your loved ones, and best practices for professionals.
1-800-273-8255
They have at least one emergency call box on San Francisco's Golden Gate - mb install a few here?
Fat girl here, all I see is a free gym where I'm sure everyone is puffing away so no one would have time to look at me :D
Well, I am pretty sure people jump to the outside, where the stairs overhang the park. Inside, you wouldn't get far enough out, due to the angle. You would just land on a level below you.
Yea it’s nice and all but someone got ripped off for $200mms
I went there in december but it was closed bc somone had comited suicide just minutes before i arived
People on here making witty jokes about the suicides should be fucking ashamed of themselves! Those were someone’s family member and it’s no laughing matter. Show some decency
As someone who has been there multiple times, it’s not as amazing as it looks. It’s just stairs
I don't care if its privately funded. $200 million to fund a useless structure that could've gone to charity or alleviate the housing costs for the needy in NYC is sad.
I mean, yeah. My dumbass brain took one look at that thing and thought 'Jump' without even looking at the caption.
RIP to the people who fell.
Aside from the mentioned suicides I could see this as a goldmine for those fitness people who want to climb every step
Are the stairs and the suicide really the problem here? Let's just ignore what's causing so many people to be compelled to want to jump off the top of those stairs.
Myself included.
The NYU law library is like 15 minutes away. There are huge plexiglass barriers on all of the levels to prevent what used to be very regular suicides. I still can not believe they built this thing at all. Who wants a view of New Jersey? Also the Empire State Building is like six blocks east, and also has massive barriers to prevent anyone from going over. A lot of bridges have suicide barriers, and some of the larger and more famous bridges have had barriers added to them during the past four years. It sounded like a terrible idea before it was built, and it is. How this thing was given a green light is beyond me.
Wow. Downvoted by a fucking idiot who has never set foot in the city, and probably can’t spell NYC
what kind of a society are we that every place that's elevated has to be barricaded with plexiglass to stop us from flinging ourselves to our death? why are so many of us so desperate to kill themselves?
Because the actual buckets of rat piss disguised in suits who are “running the government” of every country need to be lit on fire and thrown off of a similar structure. Their narcissism, psychosis, and affinity for oppression are putting literal billions of people in despair and buying them yachts. Fuck a scumbag at a podium. Every single one of them should be in the dirt.
These words. Exactly - they are literally wasting the potential of humanity so their great great great great great great great grandchild can have a golden plated yacht.
Fuck them with an unlubed cactus.
Master/slave is a model of asymmetric communication or control where one device or process controls one or more other devices or processes and serves as their communication hub. In some systems, a master is selected from a group of eligible devices, with the other devices acting in the role of slaves.
Here is a quick diagram explaining the function
Yeah, that’s been workin out great for us. Smash the fuckin state. If you think the pyramid has two peaks, you are on another planet
Words, meaning quarn phleb much, yes? Clueb such not ares less marbles for not. Yes, snacks when got bake Submunthing. Oh Z! Zee Best! Gosh, from mother lunch halved samwich. Sigh.
Yeah, I’ll never understand being so suicidal you feel the need to do it in a public place. I know some people that have attempted and none of them did it in public. One of them straight up said they didn’t wanna ruin someone else’s life by traumatizing them having to watch someone off themselves from a building. I deal with chronic depression so I understand how fuked the mind gets, but still I can’t wrap my head around jumping off a building onto a street where people are.
Life is great when you are not constantly at war or being worked as a slave, because some people across the Atlantic and Pacific needed cheaper oil or a faster smart phone.
It doesn’t mean you still can be happy, it’s just means that if you are totally unaffected by it you can make comments like:
‘Why would people want to kill themselves when billions of dollars are spent on killing the Earth and other people’
Paraphrasing a bit there.
It wasn’t the law library at NYU, but the regular library - Bobst. And it wasn’t very regular suicides, but a rash of suicides one year.
There are reports people asked to put up suicide barriers at the Vessel several times, both before and after the suicides started, but the developers balked. They didn’t want to ruin the views, as though a dead teenager isn’t a little worse than a slightly obstructed view.
It has a view of New Jersey? Jesus, no wonder so many people kill themselves there!
Maybe just maybe these city designers should first address the problem as to why so many ppl want to kill themselves in this day and age. Perhaps we're living in a dystopian capitalist nightmare?
That’s not a city designer’s problem. That’s a government problem.
This was a dogshit area of the city that nobody went to, a real estate development company made the area a lot nicer and put this “artwork” in the middle of it as an attention-getter and crowd-gatherer to get people to come to that area of town.
And it actually worked very well, but it is tragic that people have used it to take their lives. But, many more have used other structures in New York and they won’t be the last.
It is a fine state and I’ve had some incredible times there. The view is not worth having a $200 Million suicide platform.
Why don’t they put netting up? That’s what they’ve done with a lot of bridges.. side note: it looks diabolical
committing suicide seems to be about the only thing the vessel is good for. it's ugly, serves no purpose except to take pictures of. there are no benches, so you can't even stroll and sit down. you need to get a ticket to go on it (they're free, but who wants to plan to see a free park structure). and it's built on the most absurdly expensive gentrification project in manhattan, which is completely empty because nobody needs another shopping center filled with gucci and prada
they spent hundreds of millions to turn it into a rich people hang out that rich people don't hang out in, when they could have built affordable housing, or even just like, a medium nice neighborhood like nolita or west village
I mean, once they reach the top i guess some people choose the fast way down rather than having to walk all the way back
Jokes aside, it must be a factor too. When it’s really easy to not commit suicide, you may just stop yourself and leave. Here they can’t even leave easily.
They have to go down the stairs for 5-10 mins if they decide to not do it
As someone who lost a family member to suicide, the top comments are disgusting. Find another post to make a joke about.
I hate to say it but if the deaths were the result of systemic problem there would be no jokes in the comments section allowed let alone the top ones. How is 50k ppl a year killing themselves not seen as a systemic problem? No one is born with suicidal tendencies, therefore, they must be a result of society. So have your laughs and keep being part of the problem.
Wishing everyone here is having a good mental health day
So glad I’m not the only one appalled by the comments. I wouldn’t wish the heartbreak of losing someone to suicide on anyone.
The people probably aren’t even suicidal, they’re probably just so lost they give up
That look like a nice spot for some stair workout. If you walk/run through all of them per day you gonna get pretty fit
NYC residence were and still are pissed. It could've been affordable housing, regular housing, shops, businesses, it could've been so many things. But instead it's an expensive bullshit building that will probably needed to be torn down one day. Those who built it and approved it made off with the money.
Made off with the money? It was privately funded by the largest landlord in NYC, if the contractors and builders made off with their money, then… good? You could say the same thing about every nonessential privately funded thing. Your average blockbuster costs more than this and could have been affordable housing too.
Imagine being depressed and poor, barely affording food, and then stumbling across a useless monument seemingly built to end your miserable existence
Looks more like something for r/ABoringDystopia, sadly...
I just found this blurb on the Hudson Yards website : "Vessel is made extraordinary by the people who visit, and by experiencing it with others." In light of this Reddit post, that sentence takes a DARK turn.
There’s no way in hell this cost $200mil
Edit: ok just looked it up, looks like it was originally supposed to cost $75 mil (still an idiotic amount) and it went over budget and is estimated to have cost between $150-200mm. What in the actual fuck.
I guess only solution would be a giant trampoline at the bottom!
Well fuck it then.
Rename it "suicide staircase" and charge money to get in.
Morgue Mobiles hanging out at the bottom.
If life gives you a silly sculpture, make demonaide.
There’s a doctor who sits up top with his tools ready to give you knee surgery if you ever make it up there
Well at least they figured out the stairs are the root cause of the suicides /s
^ Happy it’s getting put to good use if you use nitrous gas they just revive you in the hospital
If you build it high enough, they will jump. It’s almost as if we shouldn’t be living like this.
I don't blame them. The stairs are nice.. the humans are garbage.
I was going to ask where the stairs led, but then I realized it was the stairway to heaven.
Is there a dude lying on the ground in the left hand side of pic (maybe 2nd from top?). Anyone else see that?
I guess they shoulda spent that 200 mil. On mental health programs not a flippin staircase.
People have free will. No one asked to be here. If someone doesn't want to be here anymore they should be allowed to self exit.
Should've spent that $200 million on mental health help instead
Shoulda have spent that $200 million on mental health services and not that ugly ass 12 year olds Minecraft build.
200 mill can get a drug developed for a rare disease, what a tremendous waste.
If the same amount of money that cost to make this uneccessary absurdity was spent on health care and financing the poor this could probably have been avoided
an amazing staircase being closed down due to constant suicides and the top comment "well it would be a lovely place to die"
seriously. i know it's a meme.. but what the fuck is going on right now ? you hear about suicides being so plentiful it shuts down a structure from operation and you go "you'd see pretty stuff before you cracked your head and spine, legs and arms on the concrete pavement and bleed everywhere for other members of the public to witness and see. what a nice death"
and this is echoed throughout the entire thread bar a handful of comments.
Sociopaths..
this post is really sad.
A set of aimless stairs, eternal ups and downs. The point of this sculpture is that everything is pointless. No wonder people keep killing themselves here.
They literally have a bullseye in the middle... atleast before death you can still get a high score for a center hit... but you get 1 try, so make it count...
Also beautiful construction and placement, aside from the death game
The old l’appel du vide.
That red bullseye at the bottom isn’t helping.
Considering how unaffordable and broke NYC is, building a suicide staircase was not a smart move.
Spending $200 M on a fucking glorified staircase while mental health problems are on the rise.
Makes sense.
What’s it a vessel for? Sore quads? ::nudges you:: AMIRIGHT??!!
Where does this money come from to build a massive useless death machine?
why wont they just build a glass cover so they cant literally jump out?
Could have prevented some if not all of these suicides if they’d built higher railings and barriers on the upper levels instead of leaving them the same height as the lower levels for “aesthetics”.
They are repeating the mistakes of the Golden Gate Bridge directors, who for many years refused to construct a suicide barrier because it would ruin the appearance of the structure.
Imagine killing yourself and making it a problem for others like mate just fuck off in a river or something.
i wonder how many of NYC’s homeless youth they could’ve fed and sheltered with the money they use to fund that vanity staircase to nowhere.
unfortunately. it’s a centerpiece in a newly developed livery apartment and shopping center on the west side. literally no new yorker can afford to live there.
it’s designed for tourists and rich foreigners
Bruh they could stop a large amount of starvation but like the business people were like staircase yes
Put a Futurama style suicide booth at the bottom, problem solved. Forcing those who don’t want to exist to exist is rude.
This is so sad for everyone involved. The person dying by suicide, their family, the people who witness it, and the ones that investigate and clean it up. The mental anguish a person must be in. Truly heartbreaking.
This feels like the weirdest thing. If people want to kill themselves they will. Banning these stairs just to keep it out of sight will only serve to not bring awareness to a societal problem.
Just my 2 cents as a formally depressed and suicidal person. Getting rid of all bridges and high up jumping spots won’t stop suicide. But making it a little bit harder for someone to carry out their plan may be the extra time someone needs to get help or have some hope.
Didn't they consider the ramifications before designing and building it?
How many homeless veterans could you house and help with 200 million dollars? Yay nonfunctional architectural art!
IKR. Those goddamn depressed people fuck it for everybody!!! they just kill themselves…..wait.
As a fat man this is a nightmare. No wonder people are jumping off it.
He saying if you are gonna off yourself don't fuck up everyone else's day with it
I am well aware of what he is saying, and I am saying that absurdly tone deaf regarding mental health issues
I mean it is a asshole move to off your self in public. Also there are plenty of videos of people getting clapped when dipshits throw themselves off building s
Sorry but that’s a fucking bitch move. Jumping and dying in front of people who didn’t have to see that. Do it somewhere where nobody will see that bolognese
Depression is one hell of a drug, I guess…I’ll do some research and come back to you, but I’m pretty sure it messes with your brain enough that you’re unable to think about that stuff or something. Idk
The last person that jumped was a 14 year old kid who did it in front of his family. . .
What is the point of this, exactly? A bunch of stairs to climb for the hell of it, because everyone loves climbing stairs with no goal involved?
It’s for taking selfie on. That’s the purpose. In fact when you go there it’s loaded with signs saying any pictures taken there belong to Hudson yards.
does everything need to have practical function?
What's the point of a mural?
What's the point of a painting?
What's the point of the statue of liberty?
It has neither practical function nor artistic function. And apparently is a public health hazard as well.
$200 million and four people’s lives seems an awfully high price to pay for something that “some people like.”
People could be enjoying this outdoor structure, bringing a tiny amount of joy or tranquility to families and individuals during a very difficult time.
Instead it’s inaccessible because someone made the decision to end their life in the most public way they could think of, almost certainly with the knowledge it will destroy this place for everyone around them.
Selfish is the only word I can think of. It’s a bit harsh though, I’ll admit.
There's plenty of other high places to commit suicide, why do they have to be cunts and do it there?
I mean, there's 150 other taller buildings nearby if they fancy it, why close that one?
Suicides you say? Where is it exactly? I’m that depressed i should avoid it
It was privately funded by Related, the biggest landlord in NYC. It’s where your rent money goes, not your taxes.
Proof yet again that so much of our built-up environment is anti-human.
Maybe if whoever built this spent $200 million dollars to help people improve their mental health, living conditions, or any other societally induced causes of depression, they wouldn’t have to worry about people killing themselves on their ridiculous bridge.
Note to organizations or governments with an extra $200m to spend on stairs:
Spend that $200m addressing the mental health crisis in your community/society instead.
It was paid for by the biggest real estate company and landlord in NYC, as a long term promotional project. Addressing the mental health crisis doesn’t promote your company unfortunately.
Neither does building something that turns into a grand suicide venue ...
Maybe instead of buying fucking netting, governments invest into the people keeping them fucking floating? Im so sick of governments gouging and allowing people to die as if theres nothing to do about this shit. Fuck all governments.
Good thing it wasn't the cities money but a privately paid for art piece!
Keep staircase open and block off a spot on the ground to stay clear of. Some win. Some fly. Some die.
This whole comment section really flew off the rails, kinda like all those people who flew off the staircase and oh my god I’m apart of it now
Idk If I wanted to kill my self I would cash out all my investments and credit cards because fuck banks, (amiright?) and have a really crazy vacation and then pay some village shaman in s.e asia to brew me the tea of long sleep or w.e and then die. Too bad real depression is a mental illness...
How do you like this $200mil staircas.. What are you doing? Step away from the edge... Sir? SIR?!
200 million dollars for a pointless staircase, to look at concrete buildings form a higher view. Yet can't get affordable Healthcare. The American dream!
No offense, but I'd probably kill myself if I tried to walk up that many stairs too. 😂
Imagine spending 200 million on a glorified staircase - just think how much more could have been put to much better causes.
Wonder what could happened if they invested $200 million in mental health instead.
It is not Suicide, I am getting dizzy just looking at the Pic... The fell due to that optical illusion...
Oh man you haven't lived.
Dial up any building erected between 1955 and 1995.
Ukranian Kiev buildings from 1640-1570 before Paris existed, before German Sagaydachnuy here pics
Damn suicidal people are so inconsiderate, why don’t they think about what and who their actions would effect?
Edit: it was a joke
Yikes, bro, have some compassion. You really hate people that are suffering because they ‘ruined a bridge’ or whatever??
If I was going to suicide I'd do it someplace like the ocean. I've thought about it. I wouldn't want to leave a mess.
The dead don't suffer, that misfortune befalls the living. The unknowing pedestrians that may be forced to witness something legitimately traumatizing, the cleanup crew that definitely will, not the mention the victim's family and friends. They are the ones that will suffer.
The awful suffering that leads people to suicide is a very different conversation, but don't think that suicide isn't an extremely selfish action. It absolutely is.
Bring a picture of your ex wife and her new lover. Stare at it on your way down. Boom. Problem solved.
I’m not sure if your asking why plural or something else, but so far it has been the area for 4 suicides. 3 lone young adults. They then changed the place to you have to pay, added a mandatory buddy system, and more security. After that a 14 yo jumped in front of his family. And now its what you see.
The people who made it denied to raise the barriers or add netting. Because ascetics!
If you’re going to jump at least pick a place in which to enjoyed view on the way down.
You have the height, you have a target 🎯 right in the center. It's either a spitting contest or the final solution.
I’d spin and try to hit the bullseye like a real life version of Skate 3 Hall Of Meat
They probably end up committing suicide because they cant figure out any other way to get off that thing...
It gets worse. They used money intended for low income families on this huge expansion to Hudson Yards. It’s absolutely atrocious
Humans are so weak they gotta close this beautiful feat of engineering. Like just do what you gotta do in the privacy of your home. Never got why people chose to go out in the public eye.
The privilage of suicide when you can adjust your life before the eyes
What a massive waste a money. A stairway to nowhere, a landmark? And now it's closed forever?
You think they could just put plexiglass walls or iron fences on the higher floors, or have a net around the base like Eiffel tower.
Either way, solutions to jumpers should have been implemented long ago...
I was wondering why I didn't know about this.(it's in Nee York) It's because it's super new and is mostly closed. Also, the pandemic probably hasn't helped.
Classic 'blame anything but the lame who made a poor decision' situation.
Where do we draw the line of closing things down and ruining them for everybody because a couple people killed themselves there?
Anybody else notice the homie on the second to the top floor sitting down on the ground? He okay? They about to catch one of these suicides live on camera!
What fucking idiot picks this as your suicide spot. Hit every staircase on the way down.
Looks like gate keeping suicide from people in wheel chairs…with extra steps.
It’s a suicide stairway and pretty much nothing more. I know people that work security there- they closed it recently due to another suicide, said they were going to “reevaluate,” and returned with a plan to hire more security and CHARGE MONEY for admission now. So a few weeks back, someone paid their 10 or 20 bucks and jumped off the top... again... Disgusting.
I'm probably gonna get flogged for this but i find it so horrible that people do it there.. not because i feel sorry for them.. but because i think it's so selfish and so inconsiderate of others... the death of these people meant nothing else than trauma for whoever went there that day, and absolute devastation of something meant to be intriguing and beautiful..
I feel sorry for people seeing no other way out but to take their own lives. But that can't be an excuse to ruin others.. imagine a child, or even anyone really, seeing a person explode on impact in front of them..
Whata bunch of assholes… go die somewhere else. Don’t ruin everyone else’s day.
SHOCKING: Footage of what happens when you jump- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9ig4PzP2Sw
Can someone please explain why you would chose this method of suicide over anything else such as drug over dose for example?
Damn kinda strange I haven't seen any jumper videos from here on any of the gore sites I frequent. People need to be quicker with the phones
With pills there is a chance that you survive and it will probably not be quick. Jumping of the staircase however is quick and there is no chance that you survive it.
Unfortunately, that is not true. There was a man that committed suicide nearby where I live. He jumped. He was alive for hours before he bled out.
Yeah i know about those cases but i was talking about this specific spot, if you go to the top and jump you are going to die
Seems like a waste of money,resources and time.
Art is great but its not great when your people don't have Healthcare....That are living pay check to pay check, kids that are going hungry and a population that's sick, depressed, hopped up on pills and booze going 150mph down the highway.
People wouldn't jump and your art would be respected/cherished by all if the world around it wasn't fucking burning to the ground....
If you jump from the highest stairs you can collect the red orb below and complete the achievement.....THE FINAL WIN...
I wonder how the architect of this ugly abomination feels knowing that the sole purpose it has was triggering people with suicidal thoughts.
I mean they could’ve just added elevators and aces a shit ton of money.
where are all the blood splatter stains from suicides? someone needs to run a black light on this
Have you ever felt like this? Everything hurts so much that you don't care about the aftermath...
This is the ultimate stair for climate eco-warriors who want to sacrifice themselves at the mouth of the volcano and die to save the planet from their evil CO2 breath.
If the only thing stopping you from jumping off a high place is a barrier, you don't deserve to be saved. The hand wringing about whether this stupid stair thing encourages suicides is absurd.
"tHE nERVe Of sOmE PeOPLE! KiLlINg TheMSelVES aNd nOw I canT gO To ThE StAiRS"
This thing looks ugly anyways. Please just raze it to the ground and build a park or something.
Maybe they just can’t figure out how to get off the staircase and just decide to die.
It's their way to offset the carbon footprint of all that concrete.
It literally leads to nowhere too
Imagine they spent just 5% (10 million) on finding out why the fuck it costs $300 dollars for one insulin vial when you can get the exact one in diff country for a few dollars??
Who walks up stairs that don't lead any where? Side note stairway to heaven
I’m trying to come up with a reason for this to exist. I guess it might be good for exercise? But apparently you have to pay for admission to it like an attraction…
Uh. I’ll just say “not for me”.
It gives you a 360 degree view of the whole area from one position, which could attract tourists. Tourists already go to the nearby Empire State Building to get a view that isn’t 360 degrees.
Theres also a long ass line to go walk on it. It’s ridiculously stupid
If my grandma saw this she would immediately die just from thinking about going up and then down all those steps
I mean when they made this no one in the planning room thought of people using it for suicides. It’s even the right height for death on impact.
Just cause they're first to the top doesn't mean they're the last ones to the bottom
You can see the person in the top left thinking about taking the plunge.
They built a staircase to nowhere. What did they think was gonna happen?
You sure they committed suicide? From my perspective, maybe they all just got disoriented and fell off.
Wouldn't it be a bit easy to install nets every other floor or something?
No offence but if you build something like this, you’re practically asking people to use it as a quick way out
This is a modern day equivalent of a "Folly Tower".
How much does it cost to maintain this monstrosity?
Call me cynical, IMO this was built to laundry money into the pockets of politicians.
Maybe they should think about removing the target at the bottom then.
There’s plenty of big ass cliffs in pretty much every state or some bridges that’ll do the job. Stop being lazy and go for a drive somewhere where nobody is around. I’m not being heartless just realistic. A good friend who worked at the Grand Canyon said it is a WEEKLY occurrence, you can’t stop someone if that’s what they want to do. They would just go look in the parking lot for vehicles that haven’t moved or they find notes on them.
It reminds me of the vents above the engine compartment on lambos
Just put a big net at the bottom a la "catching a guy shot out of a cannon".
Yeah I'd commit suicide too if I just climbed a massive computer part.
Well that’s what they get for creating such a great place to commit suicide!
look there is an easy way to solve this problem.
install a suicide booth at the bottom.
My question is why would they build a staircase for 200 million that leads nowhere?
I went up there. It was neat. Nice view. Good workout. Decided to take the long way down though.
I worked at a restaurant on the top floor of Hudson Yards and I can confirm this is totally true
can you blame them ? that shit looks like inter-dimensional gate, you basically have 50-50 chance of either going splat or waking up in another world
Why is the vessel particularly such a problem? This doesn't happen with like the roof of the rockefeller or empire state or something?
They have suicide prevention systems already in place. The Empire State Building has a 10 foot fence at the top.
Who designed this monstrosity and thought cool let’s build it. Obviously a rich white guy. I looked it up just in case🙄 Thomas Alexander Heatherwick 17 February 1970 (age 51) London, Englan
What’s the purpose of this place? Just a big structure that people come to walk around?
It's cool, but not functional at all. I'm sure the streets are still covered in potholes
Because of the suicides (4 of them since the opening on March 15, 2019), there's a chance that The Vessel will be closed permanently.
Real talk, I’ve had numerous nightmares involving being climbing stairs ridiculously high up like this. The only thing they could do better is have transparent glass platforms and steps.
Well there's a fucking bullseye at the bottom dead centere where the fuck else they meant to jump?
I mean......I absolutely do not condone suicide but talk about "going out in style" lol
And from what I can tell, from this image and others, it serves no fucking purpose whatsoever.
It's like a $200,000,000 Futurama suicide booth.
This could be so cool if they just marketed the suicide nets as some kind of adult playground.
They just need to designate a specific area for jumpers where they won't land on anyone or anything below.
Then assign two people there.
First, A counselor if you're doing it because you want attention and want to be talked out of it.
Second, a big burly guy if you're serious about it to give you a shove if you lose your nerve.
I wanna jump into the picture! I just wiped out my monitor and all my speakers and shit! It's like black magic fuckery in my mind man!
Quick fix with a cost. Place plexiglass on each stair case, that inverts to the next level. Result no suicide risk, and human plinko....win win.
I mean. I would if I could. Something about it is really interesting
I just watched a video of someone visiting that yesterday, random. Looked cool. I wouldn’t go if it cost money but it’s free so I’d probably go see it. Nice views.
Maybe they should've invested that £200 million into the community instead of building some stupid fucking staircase where people who probably could've done with that money decide to kill themselves.
My favorite thing about it is the fact that it looks like a giant shawarma.
It's beautiful, but architects must understand humans are susceptible to bad ideas. So those ideas must be accounted for in the design. That would look terrible wrapped in glass. Maby a different color glass in each hexagon could be cool.
I wonder if it has some weird thing that causes people to act on the “call of the void”. Similar to how certain noises and color combinations can freak you out.
It's TRUE. Everytime I wanna visit, it's closed. Sad for the ppl though. Depression sucks.
Am I the only one recognizing this from The Chainsmokers Takeaway music video
Remember Kids. There is always a couple of stairs available for a decent suicide
What an ugly piece of shit anyway. $200 million??? Anyone behind this project should be ashamed.
just put a couple trapeze nets across it every 3 floors. Put more motivational signs or whatever around it.
Yeah, if I had to walk up that everyday I’d throw myself off of it too.
This looks like the place that Captain America fought himself. Is it?
I’d like to say this should be posted on r/crappydesign but it’s kind of beautiful. Maybe crappy forethought?
Just like Twitter and brining water on a plane, another thing is ruined by the crazies
From the Hudson Yards website:
The extraordinary centerpiece of Hudson Yards is its spiral staircase, a soaring new landmark. This interactive artwork was imagined by Thomas Heatherwick and Heatherwick Studio as a focal point where people can enjoy new perspectives of the city and one another from different heights, angles and vantage points.
Comprised of 154 intricately interconnecting flights of stairs -- almost 2,500 individual steps and 80 landings -- the vertical climb offers remarkable views of the city, the river and beyond.
Vessel is made extraordinary by the people who visit, and by experiencing it with others. Each of you matter to us, and to so many others.
if they didn't want people to jump they shouldn't have put a target in the middle
Suicide is badass, I say let them jump or put a net at the bottom, this is free world
Oh man, I am going straight to Hell for how hard I laughed at this.
Maybe they need to make the railings higher and unclimbable, as well as putting up phones that connect to suicide hotlines and perhaps have people stationed there who are trained to talk to people who are struggling. I believe we have to do whatever we can to stop people from taking their own lives. I lost my brother and it was absolutely devastating to my family. I really am hurt for every single victim and their families.
Don’t close it just add an elevator maybe then they’ll stop taking the quickest way down.
new form of population control, really cool stairways to nowhere... wasnt there a simpsons episode...
If I found myself trapped in this beautiful vertical labyrinth I might do it too.
Vertigo 2: Things Are Lookin’ Up
I went on it and honestly it was underwhelming. Probably because sir was also extremely cold
Yeah I went bought a ticket. It was closed due to an accident as soon as I used my ticket. I had to send an email for a refund that I never got.
Today on: a lot of Redditors are going to hell. 👀😅 (I laughed at some of the comments too, guess I'll see y'all there)
If you zoom in top left second from the top. Maybe alot of people are just trippin.
If this cost 200 million, why can’t they get somebody on watch full time?
Forgot the way down? Bathmophobic and sleep walked up there? Trippy stairs!
Doesn't look any more appealing to non-suicidal people either.
I guess design before safety will be next century's thing.
Suicide prevention researcher, former crisis responder, mental clinician, person who struggles with suicidal thoughts, lost my father to suicide. So I know a bit about this subject.
Responding to the folks who question the impact of a net, specifically suggesting that the person would just climb off the net or find some other way to do it.
TL:DR Nope to both. Suicide is usually impulsive and in reaction to some life stressor. The crisis is time limited. Death is not the goal, it's just the option that is always there. Make it hard for someone to die, they figure out they don't want to and come up with another path forward.
Most suicides are impulsive, quick decisions to make an attempt to die. The crisis is time-limited and most people with suicidal thoughts, or even who make attempts, don't die by suicide. If you stop someone once, they usually won't make another attempt. They don't usually switch to another means if their go-to method is taken away. People who want to shoot selves don't Open up their veins if they can't buy a gun. The woman who wants to jump off the bridge isn't going to step out into traffic if she sees the net.
A fear of pain is a huge barrier to people trying to kill themselves. It's why there aren't a lot of completed suicides with knives or self-immolation. A metal net, like they are building under the golden gate bridge is supposed to hurt like hell to land on. And hard to climb out of. If people know they are going to get hurt AND aren't going to die, then they probably won't make an attempt. Landing in a net will also usually give the person a chance to rethink whether they actually want to die. Most attempters do not. There is some other goal.
So that is the theory anyway with anacdotal support. It "feels" like the right answer. There is not a lot of good data to say whether they actually save lives or reduce suicide rates.
That said, for an individual you are concerned about, help them come up with a plan to put time and space between very dangerous items they could use to attempt suicide (firearms, poisons). You can call the national crisis line and ask for advice. 800-273-8255
Info on the golden gate net. http://www.bridgerail.net/golden-gate-bridge-suicides/the-net-fact-sheet
How expensive is it to just add a big net? Didn’t some factories do that shit in Asia? Very sad how something that looks so cool has this flip side, same with bridges.
Fuck the appearance, I can’t believe they don’t put suicide cages or nets at this point. It needs to be more common. Even some dickhead traplords add suicide cages to balconies so people don’t fall off. This kinda belongs in the assholedesign sub.
I remember when the High Line was still just a rusted out, abandoned rail track. When it was first opened it was sort of a big deal but that was before the extensions were paired with "revitalizing" the real estate and closing all the gas stations and parking lots in the area. The last time I worked over there I walked the whole thing to find that they had terminated this architectural marvel with this "experience" here, a circular exercise route surrounded by high-end shops. I was sort of horrified by the thing, and I am not really surprised people are using it to end it all. Everything is condos and bare patches of greenery over there.
It does look like a good place to do it. Just saying. I’d prefer a natural beauty.
They have to close it each time so The Vessel has time to extract the souls before the body rots. If too many pile up the bodies begin to go bad and make a stink.
Imagine you think this would make a great date idea to take your girl and was your walking up to it some MF'er lands right next to you
Look at this enormous fucking waste of money why the fuck even build this thing, and now it's not even going to be used anymore. What the fuck is wrong with people spending money for this
I mean, after walking up all those stairs… the thought of walking down more stairs is just murder.
Great place to commit suicide to be honest would looking very cool falling through the middle
If it wasn't outside, I bet Marvel would have used this somewhere in the Loki series for the TVA
I went there 2 weeks ago and there is a police man every step, you even have to book your free entrance
Why’d you close a building because people commit suicide too much? They can just do it somewhere else! This grinds my gears
10 points - Outer Rim
20 points - Inner Rim
30 points - Middle
50 points - Bullseye
Damn I knew someone that worked for the company that made that, they were so ecstatic with their work…now I wonder how they feel
It didn't even cross my mind that my question earlier could have caused any misunderstanding. Sorry if that scared anyone. (Wait, is that why that comment got over 100 up votes, 'cause people were concerned?)
Nobody can kill themselves when it’s closed? Just leave it open.
i didn't even finish reading the title when i thought "damn i could kill myself here"
What the fuck is accomplished by closing it? If someone wants to commit suicide they can just go jump off another bridge/building.
Stupid. Close every bridge then.
Acting like thousands are dying everyday when it’s a couple each year or so. Still sad but no need to waste all that money and infrastructure
They knew people in New York wanted to die so they made an attraction to help them out
Where is it and where does it takes you? Beautifull piece of art!! But no use i guess ,
The key is to base jump off each level (from top to bottom) until the chute fails to deploy in time
Ok, I can't be the only person who laughed after reading the title.
Am I the only person who laughed?
What a beautiful architectural design! So unique and interesting.
Oh, people keep flinging themselves off of it...right, I guess that makes sense.
Having been here, it’s actually a really pretty view when you get to the top. Strikes me as a thing they built that was originally meant to just be cool looking but then they decided “why not add stairs and make it an attraction?” When you get to the top the view is great and almost makes the stairs worthwhile (even for someone like me who was on the verge of panic attack the whole time because of the heights) it is sad people choose this place to end their life but I can say from my experience (mind you they were just about closed for the night when I went) there’s actually a security person every “flight”
Only 4 deaths in 2 years. I’m guessing the city fucked up letting this thing get built and want to make way for a more tax paying building to move in. A building of stairs pays much less than a building of apartments in taxes.
It kind of looks like a suicide staircase. It’s really cool, but maybe should have put some tall glass sidewalls to it
Looks nice, but should have stayed on paper. This shit is an abomination. Reminds me a lot of Dubai. Looks nice, but its all shit for nothing.
Either life is important enough to close the vessel AND to force everyone to wear masks and get rid of guns outside of law enforcement and military.
OR
We can skip the masks and vaccines altogether and let nature run its course and kill 2% of society and you can keep your fucking guns (but put a biometric trigger on them, and license them like you do a car, and you can lose the privilege if you screw up).
Choose 1 of the above.
Maybe they should allow people to have unprotected sex up there, you know to balance the death toll with newborns
Damn, what a strange, beautiful, iconic place to die. You couldn't make it better, unless you skydived from a passenger jet and impaled yourself on the wreath of the Statue of Liberty.
I was gonna link Connor O’Malley’s incredible video “Hudson Yards Video Game” that features the Vessel, but for some reason its been taken off YouTube. Maybe a copyright strike from Tool?
Did they forget to construct the building? VE’d out all but the stairs?
Hoping to climb it next week. Always too busy. It’s so vast but would be nice if they could have some mental health counsellors stationed there.
I'm not suicidal by any means but if I ever was would be a dope place to off myself
"They were so busy wondering if they could and never stopped to think if they should"
-Some guy
its because it's so open. many suiciders want their death to be seen by as many people as possible.
I think this was in a Connor O Malley video I can't find it now but it was one of his better ones.
I fail to see how this is the staircase‘s fault & why it needs to be punished.
maybe it's the American in me, but I can't imagine spending $200 MILLION on a set of stairs when people stop walking as soon as their ass hits the first step of an escalator...
Have an awareness event, maybe - the Suicide Basket 5k. Maybe 1k, that's a lot of fucking steps.
Have you ever heard the call of the void. If I were there I would get it.
I went there with my dad but it was closed. They said they were working on repairs. Now I’m not so sure
People are probably giving up trying to go up it and then they can't get down so they just take the quick way
Oof this is like an AI designed a better sacrificial temple after studying the aztecs and mayans
Yeah I wouldn't even make it up a fraction of the way that's what my back issues and cyst in the brain if we can make it to the top you got my respect again as someone said if you don't get distracted by one of the other options.
Looks so mesmerizing.. maybe it's not suicide but a modern-siren-architecture
The owner will charge you royalty fees if you film your own demise there.
Nice. I wonder if you can jog on that thing. Tons of people do stairs at football stadiums. Be a nicer view and plenty of resting points.
I don’t get why they don’t just make designated spots for suicide, it’d be very efficient, and people who don’t want to see that sort of thing won’t.
They should put a plastic/ plexiglass dome around it. First one is free, you’re welcome
I went there in 2019, around when Endgame came out. It's very cool, but I could definitely see it being easy for someone to want to jump.
This is stupid, closing it only makes it so that someone offs themselves elsewhere, instead of resources put into security, put resources into mental healthcare, get people the help they need instead of delaying their suicide by a couple of minutes.
A funeral service company would be a great business next to the building.
I've never seen a suicide leap that required a test of skill before. If you think you're a loser who does nothing right, you'd want to avoid this place.
Just enclose the whole thing. Clear glass tubes so you can see it but not jump off.
I’ve been to that place when I was visiting New York, or at least a place similar to that
Yeah that’d be incredibly easy to jump off and more importantly very effective…….where did you say it was?
Its just crazy how stupid humanity can be. Not because of the suicides, but because we as a society think spending $200,000,000 on fucking stairs is a good idea.
After all the frustration of figuring out how to get to the top they just want to end it.
$200m could have helped so many people... Instead it killed several. What a waste all around...
CEO: “y’know what? Fuck charity. We’re going to spend $200 million on a staircase.”
All the other executives: “say less”
This was Project Runway last season, it’s so high and people in tight dresses and heels we’re strutting up and down I was so scared for them lmao
Oh so THAT'S what that is. I've seen it from a distance a couple times when I was in NYC, but never realized it was a giant staircase!!
That would make a great paintball arena. (Or Mario Kart Battle Mode arena.)
hear me out what if, they had a designated spot. am i crazy? Just a accesible spot maybe secluded and ideally lands in a large also secluded garbage can like the ones construction uses. Thoughts?
That looks sick. Too bad people want to kill themselves. I mean it is a cool place to die
I've been scrolling through the comments and like no one's said that this is the staircase from the mv of Takeaway by the Chainsmokers
Plot twist: Its a giant sacrificial structure to feed the gods of New York and it keeps getting closed due to rituals
Hudson yards NYC???? (There are too many f*cking comments to read and I wanna know bc it looks like Hudson yards (I worked around there and I recognize this))
Life is really hard! I feel like ages 18-30 (a myriad of life AND self imposed challenges) has prepared me for the bigger challenges of 40+ life and 4 kids, aging parents, trying to get my life straight so my kids don’t have to take care of myself and my wife…I don’t say this to diminish anyone’s challenges, I just mean to say that life kicks everyone’s ass and the faster you get in front of challenging life back the better off you will be. FYI…if you get ahead, don’t stop fighting and challenging yourself because life is still coming for you! Stay ahead as far as you can and always know that the other shoe WILL drop! Knowing that and being mentally prepared is key to get through the hard times! I also strongly recommend a personal relationship with GOD
Hey, I jumped there, sadly it was to short I only end up having my joints broke
Omg, this is the same building that was in the music video of Takeaway by Illenium and I thought it was fictious!
Isn't this place where the song Takeaway by the chainsmokers was shot?
Why not put glass up?? Even plexi would maintain the aesthetic and probably not be too heavy…better than tearing it down.
I’m a bit surprised it didn’t occur to the designers that it would be a suicide magnet. Modern buildings and infrastructure are usually pretty carefully designed these days to deter suicides. People gravitate to the easiest place to go, whether it’s a bridge or a rooftop. And then once a location gets a reputation, and people know it’s a spot you could jump, it happens all the more.
The should charge an entrance fee so at least no tax payer money is being used for the cleanup.
Maybe it resembles where we are all at when we entered the simulation
Who the fart is just building staircases for nothing? Like there’s a demand for staircases.
I actually applied to work there, even got the interview, I don’t know how I would’ve reacted if it happen while working
I was there 3 weeks ago, my family went to the top while I was taking some pictures at the bottom, an employee asked me if I was with someone and them told me to get closer to my family, I didn't think much of it at the moment and assumed it was some covid rule. Now I see what it was about.
What if, and hear me out on this, but what if we made society less of an unbearable hell scape?
I realized anyone could jump off quite a few staircases at the river walk during a recent trip to Chicago. It was unsettling and anxiety inducing. I wish the thought hadn’t crossed my mind, couldn’t really shake it the rest of the trip.
Or we could try and fix the fundamental issues in society that are causing these suicides, would be easier than any of the nets you guys are dreaming up
My BF was there when someone jumped. Had to shut the whole thing down. It was pretty sad. (Not that it was closed but for the kid)
I heard a story about a guy who killed himself jumping out of the IDS tower in Minneapolis. My company had regular deliveries to the building and one of our delivery guys heard the story from a secretary who was there when it happened.
The secretary said the guy came onto the floor and went straight for one of the windows. First thing he did was run straight at the window but bounced off. He tried again with the same result. Finally he picked up a desk chair and used that to break the window. He stood there for a moment, lit a cigarette, and looked down. After a couple puffs on the cig he jumped.
The IDS building has an open, glass covered area at the bottom sort of like a concourse where people sometimes eat their lunch. The guy died on impact with the glass but since the glass wasn't made to hold up under that kind of stress it broke and ended up separating his torso from his head and limbs. Pretty gruesome for the people eating their lunch that day.
This happened after they closed the restaurant at the top of the tower because they were constantly having to deal with suicide attempts there. I suppose the lesson there is that if someone's determined enough then they will find a way
I mean, maybe it’s just because I’m from the Bay Area so bridge suicides are a pretty well known phenomenon, but I can’t believe that nobody thought about that before they built it. Any attraction with height is going to attract the suicidal.
It keeps getting closed due to suicides? Exactly how many architects worked on this?
Why dont they just put a meshcage on top so you can't jump without cutting the mesh beforehands?
Couldnt they just raise the walls with glass so People cant get over it to jump?
I seriously agree with the comments to leave the bodies there. Leave cameras incase of murders but it seems noble to leave the bodies for society to reflect on.
American culture treats death like an incest child left in a basement. People/society need to face it and reflect on it.
I remember when Hudson Yards first opened up and they were unveiling all the attractions. When I saw this nonsense. I said I give it until hollooween someone's gonna jump, and I fucking swear like a few months later on my way home my citizen app went off saying someone got the record holder status.
Well.... It looks like a really nice place....
....... to end it all
Isn't this the place where the chainsmokers and illenium filmed the mv for "Takeaway" ?
Why the fuck are Irish idiots spending 200 million on a fucking staircase instead of I dunno. Helping people. Now all they've done is make a suicide machine.
I was there about a month ago to go to the edge and was pretty let down this was closed.
Just flood the base and the stairs become the worlds biggest diving platformp
Let them. Then somebody can get hired to clean up the mess. Thereby creating more jobs.
This is gonna be fucked up, but what’s a more beautiful place to jump off of?
This feels like the weirdest thing. If people want to kill themselves they will. Banning these stairs just to keep it out of sight will only serve to not bring awareness to a societal problem.
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